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[Split] Marauder discussion

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Coryphaus
Posts: 2230

Re: [Split] Marauder discussion

Post#411 » Thu Oct 15, 2015 3:47 pm

bloodi wrote:
Coryphaus wrote:sw can kill targets just dam fine 1v1 unless youve forgotten just how well the class can kite targets :roll:
You can play this deflect game all you want, this discussion started with you pointing out that you cannot rely on others to survive festerbombs, hell i can quote it even:


Coryphaus wrote:I realize that festerbombing is gimmicky as **** but just dont like being instantly killed out of nowhere

the deathskulls is not exactly a "competitive rvr guild" like critical acclaim or some other guilds so ive had to more or less play without guard and 30 fts 5s detaunts are a joke espically against rdps like sw in scs and orvr their are so many targets that its kinda hard to pin point that one sw with m2 who is targeting you
So you want them to rely on others but that is not for you?
your right then every rdps in the game should be able to blow up tanks right?

so then every class should be great at 1v1 right? and able to instal kill pretty much any one on a morale?

furthemore i started this discussion by asking how it is valid to ohko some one with festerbomb
Last edited by Coryphaus on Thu Oct 15, 2015 3:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Tesq
Posts: 5713

Re: [Split] Marauder discussion

Post#412 » Thu Oct 15, 2015 3:47 pm

Rapzel wrote:
Tesq wrote:fest arrow crit do like 2k damge both on tank and on your dps, is damnit crazy,

the thing is , if the skill would make different damage based on who you are hit that would be resonable, but the skill actually is 10 sec CD moral pure damage reduced only by tough (as 100-200 dps reduction from tough would counter well 2k damage) , have it on block/dodge make even more harder counter it.
And there is no way change that client side (best would have been nerf that to 25%) unless totale remove that tactic from the game.
Yea, imagine if there was any way to interrupt 3 sec long casts or LoS existed.... Oh wait.

It's the ONLY way a SW can do damage to a tank, SW has two abilities that's not affected by armor, Flame Arrow and Festering Arrow,
the only other class that would be able to kill a heavy armor carrier would be a BW and thus we would get more "NERF BW" crying.
"But engi", yes engi's can do damage to armored targets, but they mainly do corporeal AoE damage through their grenades,
the other abilities are physical and has issues finishing a tank off (Guess why they have Piercing Shot while Magus has Glean Magic?).
The SW is mainly a single target nuker, a scout specced SW has 5 (five) AoE's and out of these 3 (three) of them are Morales.
(Hail of Doom, Explosive Shots, Rain of Steel, Flame arrow, Lileath's Arrow)

Removing the ONLY nuke the class has would make it about as useful as a wet paperbag,
and that's why SH is currently in a bad state because they lack a "real" single target nuke.
The god damn game is balanced around Rank 40, not what's happening in tier 2.
No one is able to tear through a tank in that way, and no one mean no one and also no one should be able to do such things; the worst is that you get more damage not when they attack you but when they attack your guard, cos you usually have some damage reduction buff or absorb but when they hit your guard you both take umitigable damage.
If skills make totaly worthless invest anything in a class what such class exit for?
Fest arrow it's just bad no matter how you put it.

100% ingore something it start as OP and then became broken, the more the damage start scaling.
The only reason why i took only 1.5k from crit fest arrow on my tank was due to oppression+ hardly concession + TB.

If you start considering how many things i invested to reduces this damage you should easily understand how much is broken---> 60 renow point and weren't enough to keet this type fo damage low if you didn't get it.

There is also more lets' say 2 sw pop from behind and use 2 fest arrow on 1 dok

let's say 1 crit and 1 non crit hit, they are like 3k+ damage----> my dok have 3.4k hp more or less so it's much probable i get one ista shoot downwithout being able to do nothing. (and they still haven't use rkd)

Dok/tank should be def classes they should not possibly going down by 2 hits or take unmitgable damages from a rdps there are alredy we/wh that ingore armor and they need to do that in melee and from behind, things were designed this way, if such skill in game exist it just make useless any sense of rvr archtype/configuration or balance.
This is something only morals should be able to do.

Even add that it's a 3 sec cast time it' not a valid argument cos the burst component of this skill make it broken as you dont exept so many damage pop from nothing in that way and healer have not the time to heal.

Melee train could win the day cos they keep pressure on you and you can't stay there cast but tell that something that crit 2k on a tank with no effort is "normal" dosen't exist in my vocabulry. You just want to pretend fest arrow is right cos it balance the other **** around in game.
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Ungrin
Posts: 170

Re: [Split] Marauder discussion

Post#413 » Thu Oct 15, 2015 4:17 pm

Take away Torment and Agonizing Wound. 100% armor pen that is only mitigatable by Toughness... same as fester..

You guys seem to forget what kind of damage Torment used to do on live. 2-3k crits every GCD

I think we're starting to see a pattern eh?

You guys are seeing the 3k+ crits and going "OMG so op.. nerf this.." yet haven't come across when I try to line everything up and I get KD'd or knocked back during my FA + M2 and it doesn't go off.. wasting my M2.. or when it gets blocked.. or dodged......

Literally 100% damage loss because of a renown spec. The point is, sure, FA is strong.. but it's not game-breaking strong. In the grand scheme of things FA is no more game-breaking than a WH / WE with Torment and a finisher (who btw can burst way harder than a SW).
"Look at all my RR100s!" brigade

RR100 of everything ~Badlands

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Tesq
Posts: 5713

Re: [Split] Marauder discussion

Post#414 » Thu Oct 15, 2015 4:26 pm

torment and AW are in melee and only from behind....you know is a bit differet..... also those hits can be parry rather than dodge /block and they do not the same "burst from no where in 0 second" and even damage x seconds is not even comparable.

i tough that was clear with my last post. Furthermore torment and AW are mirrored ...guess why.
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Ungrin
Posts: 170

Re: [Split] Marauder discussion

Post#415 » Thu Oct 15, 2015 4:32 pm

Tesq wrote:torment and AW are in melee and only from behind....you know is a bit differetn and those hit can be parry rhater than dodge /block and they do not the same "burst from no where in 0 second".

i tough that was clear with my last post. Furthermore torment and AW are mirrored guess why.
So mirror the tactic to SH and we can call it even? Regardless.. you're ignoring the fact that WH/WE were WAAAAAAAAAAAY higher burst than SW even on live. You pop on a tank, Feinted Position, Tormentx3 > Finisher and tank was usually super low or dead.. just like FA. You saw it happen ALL the time on live. Literally.

The point is, SW is being singled out because people see high crits from it and scream nerf.. but avoid talking about the real issue, People aren't detaunting, they aren't gaurd switching, they aren't playing properly. How often do you think I am Able to get off a perfect FA on someone like Suzu or Chaoselfa? Very, very very rarely. Usually when their tank has died or they are already being pushed back.

Please, let's not talk about the SW like this thing is just outright owning you in 1v1 and you can't even put up a fight. If a SW is just 1 shotting a tank.. you're either a lowbie or you literally have no gear on.
"Look at all my RR100s!" brigade

RR100 of everything ~Badlands

Penril
Posts: 4441

Re: [Split] Marauder discussion

Post#416 » Thu Oct 15, 2015 4:35 pm

Love it how order players always say "that skill is not broken" when it concerns a certain skill only available to them.

Ranged KD? No problem, your group will save you.
Pounce? No problem, your group should KD/Champ Challenge the WL to keep him away from you.
Shatter Limbs? No problem, Squig Herders have it too!
Fester Bomb? No problem, it can easily be interrupted.

Tell you what, give:

- Shatter Limbs to Choppas
- Remove Bad Gas from SHs, but give them a tactic like Enchanted Arrows
- Give Pounce to Maras
- Give Sorcs and SHs a ranged KD

I mean, those skills are not OP so there shouldn't be any problem, correct?

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Ungrin
Posts: 170

Re: [Split] Marauder discussion

Post#417 » Thu Oct 15, 2015 4:37 pm

Penril wrote:Love it how order players always say "that skill is not broken" when it concerns a certain skill only available to them.

Ranged KD? No problem, your group will save you.
Pounce? No problem, your group should KD/Champ Challenge the WL to keep him away from you.
Shatter Limbs? No problem, Squig Herders have it too!
Fester Bomb? No problem, it can easily be interrupted.

Tell you what, give:

- Shatter Limbs to Choppas
- Remove Bad Gas from SHs, but give them a tactic like Enchanted Arrows
- Give Pounce to Maras
- Give Sorcs and SHs a ranged KD

I mean, those skills are not OP so there shouldn't be any problem, correct?
Yeah, that's fine with me. Give Choppas SL, remove it from SH and give them EA tactic like from SW, give pounce to maras and remove pull from WL and mara and give sorc and SH KD..

I'm all for 100% mirroring.
Last edited by Ungrin on Thu Oct 15, 2015 5:05 pm, edited 2 times in total.
"Look at all my RR100s!" brigade

RR100 of everything ~Badlands

Penril
Posts: 4441

Re: [Split] Marauder discussion

Post#418 » Thu Oct 15, 2015 4:40 pm

Ungrin wrote:
Yeah, that's fine with me. Give Choppas SL, remove it from SH and give them EA tactic like from SW, give pounce to maras and remove pull from WL and mara and give sorc and SH KD..

I'm all for 100% mirroring.
My hat's off to you good sir, for i doubt many order players would agree with this.

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Coryphaus
Posts: 2230

Re: [Split] Marauder discussion

Post#419 » Thu Oct 15, 2015 4:41 pm

when a wh/we pops up on you at least you have chance to pop detaunt

my 30 ft detaunt int going to reach that sw 100ft away
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bloodi
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Posts: 1725

Re: [Split] Marauder discussion

Post#420 » Thu Oct 15, 2015 5:02 pm

Coryphaus wrote: your right then every rdps in the game should be able to blow up tanks right?

so then every class should be great at 1v1 right? and able to instal kill pretty much any one on a morale?

furthemore i started this discussion by asking how it is valid to ohko some one with festerbomb

The point is that if anyone helps you, they cannot do that anymore and when this was pointed to you, you argue that they should also need a WL armor debuffing you for them being able to kill you.

You basically asked to be able to surive by youself while also reminding that everyone else should have to group up and coordinate to kill you.
Penril wrote:
Tell you what, give:

- Shatter Limbs to Choppas
- Remove Bad Gas from SHs, but give them a tactic like Enchanted Arrows
- Give Pounce to Maras
- Give Sorcs and SHs a ranged KD

I mean, those skills are not OP so there shouldn't be any problem, correct?


Sounds great, as long as BWS also get the ability to debuff the damage of the bomb spec with the dot spec tactic, SWs get better kiting, WL get the utility of a Mara and **** slayers, they have enough.

Because there is **** that Order would love to have to but i dont see you being mad about it.

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