Tier 1-3 Scenarios are the most enjoyable content

[Mvl130]

Thanks to the new matchmaking system, scenarios in T1-3 feel now fairly balanced and enjoyable in general. Both sides have tanking/healing, and combined with the rather low gear gap between players, and the absence of premades stomping pugs, this ends up in matches that feel fair and playable most of the time

However this enjoyment is gone as soon as reaching rank 40, where the experience mostly is a bunch of zergs farming one side at respawn. I have several characters that are well geared (rr70+), I barely play them nowadays. Over these last weeks, all I have been doing is create new characters and do a bunch of scenarios with them.

I have 0 interest in enduring T4 RvR, with a midtier character it is impossible to contribute in it in any meaningful way because of the gear gap, and even if you are fully geared, there isn't much to do beside enduring mindless blobfest with two buttons pressing, WH/WE ganking parties, or half afk pvdoor.

In tier 1 and midtier, because the sets available are limited, as well as the amount of Renown points to buy passives, it is not really possible to achieve deftard builds that are unkillable, or super high burst builds that delete their target in a few seconds. While in midtier characters are not overwhelming in their power, which results in more interesting match-ups, T4 grants too much power through high level equipment, the most noticeable and annoying example being the infamous regen builds, that have been ruining the experience on this sever for years.

As such, I'd like to suggest the following :

- Tier 1 and Midtier scenarios should grant lower experience points, so that players that are really interested in participating in T4 at some point, can gradually through this balanced environment build their Renown Rank and their pile of War Crests

- Midtier should have its own RvR Lakes, so that midtier players can do RvR alongside their scenarios to experience and enjoy these two components of the game. Basically, all T2 and T3 maps would be available just for them, since these maps are too small anyway to be playable with full T2-4 mass of players, this problem being mostly noticeable in zones like Troll Country or High Pass
Usually, this idea is countered by the argument that the amount of players is insufficient on the server to allow for this split, however my counter-argument to this would be that considering how unfair is the experience for midtier players in RvR, it is fair to assume that a certain amount of new players simply quit the game upon noticing how they are forced to face overly geared characters, and how long it will take for them to reach their level of power, preventing an increase in playerbase ; also, this level of power being so high, when a character is fully geared, there is no risk involved, and as such no excitement, into beating midtier players or fresh rank 40 players in Conqueror's Ward, making T4 RvR a dull experience anyway for people who endured the gearing process, which most likely further drive players away from the game

- These two suggestions do not exactly fix the issues that are inherent to T4 (blob, and overwhelming power) ; since a rebalance of equipment is currently being worked on, my guess is that its priority should be to lower the difference between sets for fresh 40 (Conqueror's Ward) and sets for fully geared characters, by lowering the power provided by higher sets, in order to maintain as much as possible that feeling you get in T1-3 of fair fights, where nobody is completely worthless, and nobody is steamrolling others.
Regarding blob, the Interbellum project server has had the idea of giving to each spec zerg bursters abilities, which are rather weak against one warband and less, but become more and more efficient the larger it gets above one warband, example : an arrow shot in front of you that deals low damage at first, pierce through targets, and deal more and more damage for each target it hits on its way, up to 96 enemies. Giving similar abilities to all classes at rank 40 would most likely greatly help at breaking blobs in T4

[gisborne]

I agree that T1-3 are the best balanced and most fun. Everyone basically has equal gear thanks to bolster. DPS has not had the chance to scale out of control. There are less organized groups that outgear/play the pug teams.

I would love there to be T2 RvR lakes for 16-39s, but from what I understand that didn't work before due to population issues.

That said, T4 scenarios are not completely terrible and have improved with the matchmaking and renown changes.

[soldude]

I recently caught myself thinking the exact same thing. After returning to the game, all I do is create new alts just to enjoy the fun gameplay in low-level Scenarios. T4 has become so boring that I barely log onto my main characters anymore.

It would be amazing if we had a viable option to play open-world RvR at lower levels again—it’s a completely different vibe and gameplay experience compared to the T4 endgame.

Almost every MMO falls into the same trap: the gear treadmill. Right now, the power gap between a fresh level 40 and a veteran player is massive. It severely discourages people from committing to the endless grind once they leave the safety of the lowbie brackets.

Also, while Scenarios have definitely improved recently, the matchmaker still needs some fine-tuning. For starters, it shouldn’t be throwing 4-man pre-mades onto massive maps when the lobby isn't even full. If there aren't enough players, the game should just adjust and give them a smaller battleground instead.

Furthermore, matches shouldn't even start until the teams are actually full—it's better to just wait a little longer in the queue. Far too often, you play your heart out, manage to get ahead in points, and then the game suddenly backfills a massive wave of players into the enemy team, completely ruining all your hard work and making your initial efforts feel totally pointless.

[nocturnalguest]

Gear gap is a myth, dont spread missinformation

You can get yourself into full darkpromise before you hit rr50, which is literally sov tier level. You can easily check yourself historical runs made on that fancy web and figure things like rr44 BO tanking whole thing

One can argue that there shouldnt be so much PvE in PvP game however its whole different discussion

What is not a myth tho, that skill gap is so huge between newcomers and veterans that yeah, gl beating long established teams, i wouldnt be suprised if some will beat the crap out of noobs being in conq vs full sov

[Bozzax]

10% does PVE and those are organised anyway

40-60 transitioning is super poorly designed when it comes to pvp gear. Undeniably a unnecessary **** show for newcomers and bulk of the player base that don’t do pve

Very poor and unfortunate PVE focus tbh that has made rvr a side show instead of realising the full potential of WAR

[gisborne]

Gear gap is a myth, dont spread missinformation

You can get yourself into full darkpromise before you hit rr50, which is literally sov tier level. You can easily check yourself historical runs made on that fancy web and figure things like rr44 BO tanking whole thing

Come on, you can't seriously believe that. 4 runs of Gunbad, 4 runs of City, 4 runs of BS, 4 runs of LV, with a 1 day lockout between runs so a minimum of 16 days. I've been online for about 8 hours a day the last couple weeks and you know how many LV runs my WP (who needs 2 more runs) has gotten? 0. So even if we pretend that you get a run a day, what exactly do you think is happening between those runs if not RvR/Scenarios with terrible gear?

Then there's the fact that a typical pug LV group will take 1.5-2.5 uninterrupted hours. BS is an hour+. Good luck fitting that into a casual gaming schedule.

Finally, I'd argue that even without the gear gap and everyone in BiS, the power dynamic changes in a way that is less fun. DPS is crazy high. Tanks are ridiculously tanky. Heals are both very strong and yet in some situations completely inadequate.

[nocturnalguest]

Come on, you can't seriously believe that. 4 runs of Gunbad, 4 runs of City, 4 runs of BS, 4 runs of LV, with a 1 day lockout between runs so a minimum of 16 days. I've been online for about 8 hours a day the last couple weeks and you know how many LV runs my WP (who needs 2 more runs) has gotten? 0. So even if we pretend that you get a run a day, what exactly do you think is happening between those runs if not RvR/Scenarios with terrible gear?

Then there's the fact that a typical pug LV group will take 1.5-2.5 uninterrupted hours. BS is an hour+. Good luck fitting that into a casual gaming schedule.

Finally, I'd argue that even without the gear gap and everyone in BiS, the power dynamic changes in a way that is less fun. DPS is crazy high. Tanks are ridiculously tanky. Heals are both very strong and yet in some situations completely inadequate.

Believe what, that gear aint an issue? Oh you can, surely.

What is happening between runs? You play another char Really, why bother to do any PvP on a fresh 40s? Get at least wards up to bloodlord and then it becomes completely on par and playable in PvP, design aside its a player choice - you go suffer in ruin or just take you time to gear up a bit, catching up RR is always bigger pleasure being geared rather then just grief your teammates being in greenies with 5k hp. There are tons of options of how to gear any char on a levels that are just mathematically almost the same as BiS mixes, e.g. on most mdps you dont even have to set a foot into LV, you gonna be completely fine in mixes of lower then DP gear. Any low rr SnB tank can function so very close, almost same way as full sov tank just in full onslaught, gotta even have a mini LtC and no need to spend much points into FS as you will have almost 100 ini as a set bonus, so even your RR build will somewhat resemble rr80 snb tank.

I dunno what power dynamic is and how it changes. There is just no power dynamic, RR is a bit of a bottleneck due to pure amount of points available but in the grand scheme of things its mere %'s of power, definitely not what decides a win or loss in all but super high organised content (6v6, city). I however know for a fact that some people play this game way better then others and this is 99,9(999)% of what it takes to win. Rest are l2p issues.