Let the players play how they want, its a game

[Gegga]

^ what he said

[madrocks]

Did I really just read "doo doo head" in one of the responses?
Thats like ordering lemon loaf at Starbucks as a grown man.

[Gegga]

i mean, yeah

[Sulorie]

Did I really just read "doo doo head" in one of the responses?
Thats like ordering lemon loaf at Starbucks as a grown man.

Some descriptive language is required for the recipient to understand.

[madrocks]

I understand you guys disagree with Rebiff, no need to wind him up though.

I am not sure if a punishing mechanic is the right way to enforce teamplay.
I would rather enforce some sort of screen pop ups/reminders that you are in the sc to teamplay fulfill your role and play objective.
Or just not give the option at all to put yourself in a solo group.

/shrug
I try not to play solo sc in the first place. 8/10 times it ends in a disaster.

[Minisynn]

I understand you guys disagree with Rebiff, no need to wind him up though.

I am not sure if a punishing mechanic is the right way to enforce teamplay.
I would rather enforce some sort of screen pop ups/reminders that you are in the sc to teamplay fulfill your role and play objective.
Or just not give the option at all to put yourself in a solo group.

/shrug
I try not to play solo sc in the first place. 8/10 times it ends in a disaster.

Yes starting off being an arse to rebiff wasn't really needed which is why I left the thread for a couple of hours and came back less heated.

I would agree that a punishing mechanic isn't the right way to enforce teamplay if it wasn't for the fact that punishing mechanics are basically made to target players inclined to abuse game systems for their own gain at the expense of others, as opposed to targetting everyone. Most people don't need to be encouraged to group up and work as a team - they do it because it's their best chance of success, for them and their team as a whole.

Take the SC deserter debuff for example, is it there to punish people whose game crashes and they drop out of a SC accidentally? Absolutely not, even though they may get punished unjustly by the system. It's made to punish people whose first instinct is to leave a scenario as soon as things aren't going their way, just like the SC AFK kick mechanic.

Is it perfect? Nope, just like restricting RR and crest gains to 0 for people in their own parties isn't perfect - but in general it does its job of *nudging* players to play together instead of playing like a lone wolf to benefit themselves instead of their team, and after all, scenarios are team based instances - even if it doesn't always feel like it.

[wonshot]

Im not sure of this initial thoght was sparked by the scenario which i think it is:

During the weekend in Howling George weekend warfront there was a case of Destro had a premade, order had unballanced pugs.
The destro 6man + pug overflow group controled mid-area but didnt capture the flag, and pushed towards order WC leaving 1-2 order enemies alone on the mid flag to fight the destro pugs. I saw Rebiff's IB being one of them while the rest of the LFG 6man i had joined for the event continued to push towards order wc for more of the 150kills.

Noticed that atleast one Magus was sacrified on that Alter after the destro group pushed pass the objective to hunt kills, and when returning Rebiff was found on the crimescene lol.

So while I can put myself in Rebiff's shoes about if he had read the situation of the enemy group pushing wc, exposing some unsupported players behind and executed them and got no rewards for earning those kills. I also think the missing piece of the bigger puzzle, is that in scenarios you have even numbers and while order was getting spanked those kills on mid flanking the unorganized destro tail, wouldnt had happend without someone else on order to function as a lightning rod for the 6man stomping over the frontline and persueing some survivers. So while the solokill felt wrong not rewarding progression, that situation in an even numbered scenario settle should still split the rewards between those who managed to land the kill, but also those distracting the enemy to open up the situation to occure where a magus + WE was exposed in the back. Atleast thats the way i see it.

Nothing against Rebiff, and not trying to put words in his mouth. But thats how i saw that one sitation, where i could see it from his point of view how frustration could have risen.

[madrocks]

Spoiler:

I understand you guys disagree with Rebiff, no need to wind him up though.

I am not sure if a punishing mechanic is the right way to enforce teamplay.
I would rather enforce some sort of screen pop ups/reminders that you are in the sc to teamplay fulfill your role and play objective.
Or just not give the option at all to put yourself in a solo group.

/shrug
I try not to play solo sc in the first place. 8/10 times it ends in a disaster.

Yes starting off being an arse to rebiff wasn't really needed which is why I left the thread for a couple of hours and came back less heated.

I would agree that a punishing mechanic isn't the right way to enforce teamplay if it wasn't for the fact that punishing mechanics are basically made to target players inclined to abuse game systems for their own gain at the expense of others, as opposed to targetting everyone. Most people don't need to be encouraged to group up and work as a team - they do it because it's their best chance of success, for them and their team as a whole.

Take the SC deserter debuff for example, is it there to punish people whose game crashes and they drop out of a SC accidentally? Absolutely not, even though they may get punished unjustly by the system. It's made to punish people whose first instinct is to leave a scenario as soon as things aren't going their way, just like the SC AFK kick mechanic.

Is it perfect? Nope, just like restricting RR and crest gains to 0 for people in their own parties isn't perfect - but in general it does its job of *nudging* players to play together instead of playing like a lone wolf to benefit themselves instead of their team, and after all, scenarios are team based instances - even if it doesn't always feel like it.

Yes, totally agree with those explanations.
10 min quitter is actually not even that bad compared to other mmos, In SWTOR the quitter debuff even multiplies if you keep on leaving pvp/pve raids.

[SuperStar]

Spoiler:

I understand you guys disagree with Rebiff, no need to wind him up though.

I am not sure if a punishing mechanic is the right way to enforce teamplay.
I would rather enforce some sort of screen pop ups/reminders that you are in the sc to teamplay fulfill your role and play objective.
Or just not give the option at all to put yourself in a solo group.

/shrug
I try not to play solo sc in the first place. 8/10 times it ends in a disaster.

Yes starting off being an arse to rebiff wasn't really needed which is why I left the thread for a couple of hours and came back less heated.

I would agree that a punishing mechanic isn't the right way to enforce teamplay if it wasn't for the fact that punishing mechanics are basically made to target players inclined to abuse game systems for their own gain at the expense of others, as opposed to targetting everyone. Most people don't need to be encouraged to group up and work as a team - they do it because it's their best chance of success, for them and their team as a whole.

Take the SC deserter debuff for example, is it there to punish people whose game crashes and they drop out of a SC accidentally? Absolutely not, even though they may get punished unjustly by the system. It's made to punish people whose first instinct is to leave a scenario as soon as things aren't going their way, just like the SC AFK kick mechanic.

Is it perfect? Nope, just like restricting RR and crest gains to 0 for people in their own parties isn't perfect - but in general it does its job of *nudging* players to play together instead of playing like a lone wolf to benefit themselves instead of their team, and after all, scenarios are team based instances - even if it doesn't always feel like it.

Yes, totally agree with those explanations.
10 min quitter is actually not even that bad compared to other mmos, In SWTOR the quitter debuff even multiplies if you keep on leaving pvp/pve raids.

I didnt try it now but in the past even if you left the sc you got the reward when the sc ended.

[Sofong]

i will never understand this "solo in sc"attitude, no matter how u wanna play, u lose more than u gain, why not stay in grp enjoy all kind of grp buffs such as auras, dmg procs, chop faster etc.