In Game Sequencer Question

[Omegus]

Since it is ok for new addons that auto target hurt players for healing and guard (War Triage and Guard addons), can we also update the In game sequencer to skip abilities not useable?

Prime example, Warrior Priest / DoK
Both classes have damage/ snare-root breaking/ protective abilities that work with certain mastery trees and not others. So if say I am playing heal spec, and want to switch to 2h or shield spec, I have to manually sit and move abilities into main ability bar, and others out.

With NB I could stack the abilities and NB would use appropriate ability depending on if I had a Book/Cup, or Shield, or 2h/Dual wield.

Does the build/mastery switcher at the career trainer save/restore action bars? It's been a while since I looked at it but I thought I remembered it updating the action bars too. If not, then there is a gap in the addon ecosystem for saving and restoring actionbar configurations (out of combat of course), much like ClosetGoblin does for gear.

Obvious you have no clue how NB worked do you?
Just like War triage except instead of targeting people, it target usable abilities. NB picked first working ability in a stack, and that is it. The player still had to play the ability or not and play another on another stack. NB did not automate anything, p-layers still had to use their keyboards and mice. Just like War Triage and SwiftAssist target players, it is still up to players to use the abilities.

So... if it is ok for War Triage to skip a healthy player, why is it not ok for the sequencer to skip an unusable ability? If you do not see that both are the same then you have a wrongly placed bias.

Saying someone has no clue how NB works and then saying that all NB did was pick the first working ability in a stack is a bit ironic. NB could also pick between multiple "working" abilities based on other conditions such as buff/debuff timers on your targets, and then swap abilities in combat based on these decisions.

Remember: decision making via add-ons has not been banned. All that has been blocked is the ability to change action bars and keybindings while in combat, and then a very basic sequencer was added to allow for some very limited use cases. Automation and decision making in general is not restricted, only swapping abilities/keybinds while in combat. WarTriage and EZ-Guard do not swap abilities while in combat, so are not banned.

The in game sequencer does not cycle debuffs, shielding, or anything else you mention. (reality is NB did not do that either, but I digress.)

Yes. Yes NB did. That was the whole problem with it. You could literally setup NB swap your abilities based on what effects were on your target, e.g. skip your snare if the target is already snared (by anyone), skip your heal debuff if the target is already heal debuffed (by anyone, not just you), skip your armour buff if already buffed, etc. You might not have used it for that, but it was definitely used like that; the ability to pick which ability to use based on a bunch of custom checks was a key part of NB.

Another fun one: if you are channelling an ability then usually you get a buff put on you with the name of the ability being channelled. An enemy targeting you with NB installed can have it prioritise a taunt/interrupt if it detects one of those channelling buffs, allowing for almost instant interrupts.

Also why is the dev team pretending that underground version of NB that swaps skill bar instead single skill doesn't exist?

How are they pretending it doesn't exist when they have fixed a load of the existing work-arounds and the others are publicly listed on the bug tracker waiting to be fixed? You know, like the one you mentioned: https://github.com/WarEmu/WarBugs/issues/19537

Where do you think some of these "underground" versions of NB got their inspiration from ?!. There was probably an "underground" version of NB at one point that was working 100% reliably until this top-secret-known-to-nobody-except-those-who-looked-at-this-very-public-bug-tracker-ticket-about-the-exploit was fixed: https://github.com/WarEmu/WarBugs/issues/19533

There's also probably a dug-so-deep-underground-it-came-up-on-the-other-side-of-the-world version that stops you from using CC abilities if the target is immune that uses the secret knowledge contained in this definitely-not-public bug tracker ticket: https://github.com/WarEmu/WarBugs/issues/19541 (actually, in this case the ticket was inspired by the work-around found by that add-on).

[Kaelang]

But we are not talking about NB. We are talking about the in game sequncer allowing skipping of a greyed out ability in a stack.

YOU want to complain about NB and talk about it. The in game sequencer does not cycle debuffs, shielding, or anything else you mention. (reality is NB did not do that either, but I digress.)

I made a suggestion for the in game sequencer, and you started spewing NB stuff.

This is my last post on the NB topic - feel like we've been over this a billion times and the record is beyond broken.

Sequencer identifying a skill is unusable - and automatically skipping it for you in the rotation is automation.

It is exactly the same as if Sequencer could identify a condition is met and lets you use a skill in your sequence.

The difference between Sequencer and NB is exactly that - the decision making process. If you want to sequence your basic rotation, go for it. But don't start adding skills in there that require checks - there's other key binds to use.

In relation to the AddOns in question. They do not automate the skills, they show you targets just as Sequencer shows you abilities. You still have to manually input your decision from that point on.

I would also like to add that by fanning the NB flame in topics and having someone come in and shut it down isn't me 'complaining' about NB. The AddOn is gone - we have no plans to bring it back. I'm just telling you how it is.

Omegus took the words out of my mouth as I was writing this. The problem isn't us not understanding how NB worked - it's how the majority of users didn't use it to it's full extent which makes it seem like we've just taken something simple away from you - because users used it simply. The capabilities of the AddOn were insane.

[Morradin]

But we are not talking about NB. We are talking about the in game sequncer allowing skipping of a greyed out ability in a stack.

YOU want to complain about NB and talk about it. The in game sequencer does not cycle debuffs, shielding, or anything else you mention. (reality is NB did not do that either, but I digress.)

I made a suggestion for the in game sequencer, and you started spewing NB stuff.

This is my last post on the NB topic - feel like we've been over this a billion times and the record is beyond broken.

Sequencer identifying a skill is unusable - and automatically skipping it for you in the rotation is automation.

It is exactly the same as if Sequencer could identify a condition is met and lets you use a skill in your sequence.

The difference between Sequencer and NB is exactly that - the decision making process. If you want to sequence your basic rotation, go for it. But don't start adding skills in there that require checks - there's other key binds to use.

In relation to the AddOns in question. They do not automate the skills, they show you targets just as Sequencer shows you abilities. You still have to manually input your decision from that point on.

I would also like to add that by fanning the NB flame in topics and having someone come in and shut it down isn't me 'complaining' about NB. The AddOn is gone - we have no plans to bring it back. I'm just telling you how it is.

Omegus took the words out of my mouth as I was writing this. The problem isn't us not understanding how NB worked - it's how the majority of users didn't use it to it's full extent which makes it seem like we've just taken something simple away from you - because users used it simply. The capabilities of the AddOn were insane.

you are not worth the long and eloquent reply I had originally posted. I realize that you do not have the ability to understand.

[Secrets]

Kaelang - There is a distinct difference between NB's conditionals and executing 3 abilities by pressing 3 buttons in a specific order.

You might want to re-read these folks' posts. I don't think they're asking for NB's conditionals, just the ability to execute an ability that may fail and skip to the next button press.
That isn't automation, it's reducing the amount of keypresses needed. It's not playing the game for you at all.

My Logitech mouse can do that. You can technically do that using the ingame API with left mouse button up if they're on separate hot keys and the ability you wish to press is on another hotkey.

Given that the addon API for handling presses is now serversided, this should be trivial to implement without doing stuff like 'execute dot if at x seconds left'.

They're not asking for that level of control. But if the ability is **activatable below 50% ONLY** and you can't use it, and sequencer can't skip it, the addon is not doing its job. That isn't a conditional, their request is akin to 'skipping an ability on cooldown'.

These are not the same things. If you have to check the duration of a buff, and your mouse can't do that for you, it's automation.
However, this can be done using hardware with no injection into game code. It's not automation. Pretty simple.

[kirraha]

Which is one of the reasons NB was blocked.

If you want to use a sequence, build the sequence. The AddOn building the sequence for you / reacting for you, can be classed as automation.

War Triage targets low health players, similar to SwiftAssist - you still have to perform an action.

Guard isn't even in the same ballgame. It's a visual guide.

Im curious if a person would make a Macro rotaion, is that okey or concidered a cheat? Some keyboard programs allow one macro button push and you can make certain full rotations on the char.
Since you outed the comment ''If you want to use a sequence, build the sequence''

[Deathsaw]

Learn to play for real without a sequencer, be a really good player! End.

[Everdin]

Which is one of the reasons NB was blocked.

If you want to use a sequence, build the sequence. The AddOn building the sequence for you / reacting for you, can be classed as automation.

War Triage targets low health players, similar to SwiftAssist - you still have to perform an action.

Guard isn't even in the same ballgame. It's a visual guide.

Im curious if a person would make a Macro rotaion, is that okey or concidered a cheat? Some keyboard programs allow one macro button push and you can make certain full rotations on the char.
Since you outed the comment ''If you want to use a sequence, build the sequence''

Terms of Use:

1.4 No cheating.
This is one of our strongest rules and will certainly result in a swift and permanent ban.
- Don't use hacks, cheats and other illegitimate game modifications.
- Don't automate your gameplay by any means (macros, bots, gaming mice, etc.) If your character is acting in the game, you MUST be able to respond to a GM if prompted.
- Don't use any addon which creates issues or allows access to exploits.
- If you KNOW of a serious exploit or way to cheat our systems, report it to a GM or Lead (MaxHayman, Lheana, Wargrimnir)

[wargrimnir]

Which is one of the reasons NB was blocked.

If you want to use a sequence, build the sequence. The AddOn building the sequence for you / reacting for you, can be classed as automation.

War Triage targets low health players, similar to SwiftAssist - you still have to perform an action.

Guard isn't even in the same ballgame. It's a visual guide.

Im curious if a person would make a Macro rotaion, is that okey or concidered a cheat? Some keyboard programs allow one macro button push and you can make certain full rotations on the char.
Since you outed the comment ''If you want to use a sequence, build the sequence''

Terms of Use:

1.4 No cheating.
This is one of our strongest rules and will certainly result in a swift and permanent ban.
- Don't use hacks, cheats and other illegitimate game modifications.
- Don't automate your gameplay by any means (macros, bots, gaming mice, etc.) If your character is acting in the game, you MUST be able to respond to a GM if prompted.
- Don't use any addon which creates issues or allows access to exploits.
- If you KNOW of a serious exploit or way to cheat our systems, report it to a GM or Lead (MaxHayman, Lheana, Wargrimnir)

Automation generally refers to unattended gameplay, not simply the act of using macros while playing. That's why the second sentence is there, to clarify what kind of automation we're looking for.

[Evilest]

Which is one of the reasons NB was blocked.

If you want to use a sequence, build the sequence. The AddOn building the sequence for you / reacting for you, can be classed as automation.

War Triage targets low health players, similar to SwiftAssist - you still have to perform an action.

Guard isn't even in the same ballgame. It's a visual guide.

That's some mental gymnastics. Wart triage targets players and you have to perform an action. NB also required you to perform an action.

Having a conditional to use a bigger or smaller health on your action is exactly how different from an addon giving you who to heal because they need a bigger heal?

[Secrets]

Automation generally refers to unattended gameplay, not simply the act of using macros while playing. That's why the second sentence is there, to clarify what kind of automation we're looking for.

Right - and gaming mice macros that hit 3 keys once are not considered automation by definition. If you have said gaming mice repeat the keystrokes without user input while the user is afk, that's considered automation.
What OP is asking for is considered multiple keystrokes; the functionality OP wants does not play the game for you. That's what the OP is asking for - the ability to hit 3 abilities on one key in a specific order even if one isn't ''lit up''. That falls under the rules and should be a part of sequencer, but somehow isn't.

OP is asking for one keystroke that does the following when the key is pressed a single time by a player for one cycle, not repeating:
1) Always attempts to activate one ability even if it's 'greyed out'
2) Continues to the other abilities in the sequence like the "Skip Ability on Cooldown" function on sequencer

It's not a conditional as the ability being active or not is built into the game and is not a third party script.
It is not automation as the player has to still hit the keystroke to activate the 'sequence'. The player is not AFK and is able to respond to a GM inquiry.
The sequence does not repeat and the player must still manually activate the sequence again - but only once the hotkey is pressed and a single action out of the list executes.