Dual weaps or 2 hander for WL?

[Zealote]

Spoiler:

Playing a white lion from almost the start, they removed the 4 second disarm from the white lion, nerfed the pet into the ground, and they were the only melee dps class to be pet dependent and not have an incoming heal debuff. Hatchets were in the game before but they were garbage and no one would ever use them. Having them on the loot tables as unusable crap would be a waste when the purples or blue drops. White lions were the bastard class of live and giving them 10 percent parry would be the least the devs could do for them. I approve this change good sir!!

Imo you should fix the actual issues with the class, not give them a random buff. Even giving everyone (or just, for example, all mdps) the choice between dw/2h would prob still buff certain classes relative to others since some wouldn't really benefit from it - eg a WE would probably never forgo dw due to lower kiss proc rate, and you wouldn't really benefit from the 2h advantages against squishies (the usual targets). I'd still give them the choice though if you're giving it to others.

Does anyone even know why some classes can choose dw/2h and others are limited? Was it just lore/appearance-based or were there balance reasons?

I disagree in general with the "X class is crap, let's give it this random buff". It was the same with ppl saying that magus should keep Rend Winds on the move. Great... except it didn't fix the main issues magus actually had in t4 (in fact it buffed them where they already excelled - solo roaming). And on a side note, WLs are actually already strong at this lvl.

[Morf]

Imo you should fix the actual issues with the class, not give them a random buff.

It isnt a buff... 2h- 10% block(parry?) strike through and bigger auto attacks
dual wield- 10% parry smaller but faster auto attacks


About why only some classes im thinking it was lore related only. Black orcs on live cud use a shield which had the appearance of a sword, doing so your abilities used choppa ability animations so i dont think its a "this wont work because animations are not there issues".

I have always felt giving an option like this would be a good move for all classes where the option to dual wield or use a 2h is a plausible one. Tanks, wl's, wp's and sw's would fall into the category of plausible from my point of view and in most cases wud do more harm them gud.
Now how about we have sh's with spear and shield like npc's have

[xyeppp]

Now how about we have sh's with spear and shield like npc's have

If I only had like, a shield ability or something

[Gorwe]

I am sorry, WL can dual wield?

What happened to "we'll first restore the content then talk about possible rebalances / additions"?

Then I'd like to see the whole SM remade. They NEVER, not even then, use shields! If you want you can make a DPS tank of Blackguard calibre by buffing SM shields(like Phantom's blade effect, not items!), giving them high parry chances and allowing them to DW. Not that I'd forsake beautiful Tower Swords, but still is something to think about. A Swordmaster DOES NOT A SHIELD USE!

I could begin with WHs as well and some others...

[xyeppp]

I am sorry, WL can dual wield?

What happened to "we'll first restore the content then talk about possible rebalances / additions"?

Then I'd like to see the whole SM remade. They NEVER, not even then, use shields! If you want you can make a DPS tank of Blackguard calibre by buffing SM shields(like Phantom's blade effect, not items!), giving them high parry chances and allowing them to DW. Not that I'd forsake beautiful Tower Swords, but still is something to think about. A Swordmaster DOES NOT A SHIELD USE!

I could begin with WHs as well and some others...

My friend, why only stop at order characters?

[Penril]

I am sorry, WL can dual wield?

What happened to "we'll first restore the content then talk about possible rebalances / additions"?

Then I'd like to see the whole SM remade. They NEVER, not even then, use shields! If you want you can make a DPS tank of Blackguard calibre by buffing SM shields(like Phantom's blade effect, not items!), giving them high parry chances and allowing them to DW. Not that I'd forsake beautiful Tower Swords, but still is something to think about. A Swordmaster DOES NOT A SHIELD USE!

I could begin with WHs as well and some others...

Sure, your grace. Any other commands for our ad honorem Devs?

[Azarael]

I am sorry, WL can dual wield?

What happened to "we'll first restore the content then talk about possible rebalances / additions"?

I was restoring content. Hatchets.

@BG/WL debate: Lab it. You will probably find that pet damage is over the line. I heard someone say in game that the pet was contributing 44% of their damage, though the number seems excessive.

@Morf: I do not know about the live server, but on RoR, twohanders give block strikethrough (so basically no benefit at all.)

[Kaitanaroyr]

I am sorry, WL can dual wield?

What happened to "we'll first restore the content then talk about possible rebalances / additions"?

Then I'd like to see the whole SM remade. They NEVER, not even then, use shields! If you want you can make a DPS tank of Blackguard calibre by buffing SM shields(like Phantom's blade effect, not items!), giving them high parry chances and allowing them to DW. Not that I'd forsake beautiful Tower Swords, but still is something to think about. A Swordmaster DOES NOT A SHIELD USE!

I could begin with WHs as well and some others...

Sms used shields phantoms blade isn't a shield its a blade enchantment absorb bubble ect. imo not using a 2h on a sm is a mistake unless you want to be a derp turtle. (test patch changed phantoms into a group wounds buff basically a group heal from how they had it setup on test)

[Zealote]

Imo you should fix the actual issues with the class, not give them a random buff.

It isnt a buff... 2h- 10% block(parry?) strike through and bigger auto attacks
dual wield- 10% parry smaller but faster auto attacks
[]

It's a buff in that it widens their horizons in terms of spec options (more viable parry build), whereas some other classes are still confined to dw or 2h. Imo, it should either be decided that a single class should be changed and given both options for reasons X, Y, Z; or every class (at least of the same archetype) should be given it; or change none.

I thought 2h was sposed to reduce parry chance as well, but if it doesn't it's an even bigger (though still fairly small ) buff - as Azarael said there's hardly any trade-off by losing the block strike through, whereas losing 10% parry ignore by going dw would be a sacrifice you'd have to consider, depending on your build. As for the difference in AA speed/dmg, I dno enough about WL to say how it'd be affected/which would generally be better tbh.

The point, anyway, is that I don't think giving an unnecessary buff to one class on one side is a gd idea, even it if's small-ish. Obv there are bigger gear issues like the 1-handers with 2h stats, but it sounds like WL dw was deliberately implemented. I think it'd be better to either remove it, or wait till it can be implemented for all appropriate classes in future.

Agreed though morfee that giving certain classes (on both sides) the option to use both would be fun and make it more interesting

[Joshwa70]

The aa speed on these hatchets is still 2.8 seconds. Its not like its a dagger or something. The problem with wl was if you parried two aa in t4... that is like 3k damage and with a great weapon its not like you are going to parry back. As for the pet... only one setting gives them that awesome damage... bit it has like half hp. Kill it.