Sorc/BW Time for Escape

[Naelar]

Cool story.

[merfp27]

As much as I would love to see BW/Sorc get some love, I fear too many people have PTSD from their glory days on live. Nothing triggers folks more than being blown up at range before having a chance to react.

There’s a ton of stuff the Devs could do to improve them (see Sorcs useless 13 point abilities and M4s), but like someone already said, they feel they’re fine.

they never had any attention in last 7 years you expect them to get it now?

No, I know it won’t happen. I said as much in my original post. Devs feel they’re fine being a one trick pug stomping pony.

[Caduceus]

As much as I would love to see BW/Sorc get some love, I fear too many people have PTSD from their glory days on live. Nothing triggers folks more than being blown up at range before having a chance to react.

There’s a ton of stuff the Devs could do to improve them (see Sorcs useless 13 point abilities and M4s), but like someone already said, they feel they’re fine.

This is, sadly, exactly what seems to happen.

As soon as it is suggested that BW/Sorc may face problems in certain modes of play, the anecdotes arrive of when people got time-stamped by a ST Sorc or their "warband got melted" by BW Rain of Fire.

I think most serious players realize that for such things to happen, many things need to go wrong first. Those who present the anecdotes never seem to acknowledge that, leading me to believe they are either dishonest or incapable, but I digress.

I think it is important to emphasize that there are very strong indiciations that something is wrong with ST BW/Sorc. It is clearly evidenced by the performance of these classes in Ranked SCs.

At competent levels of play, ST BW/Sorc falls short, and cannot even be considered viable.

With Ranked SCs now providing some BiS items along with many other unique rewards, I do not think it is fair for this archetype to be excluded.

[BeautfulToad]

I think it is important to emphasize that there are very strong indiciations that something is wrong with ST BW/Sorc. It is clearly evidenced by the performance of these classes in Ranked SCs.

Agree with this, Ranked Solo stats make grim reading for BW/Sorc. Maybe the bomb AoE spec works, but does require a lot of careful healing and guard, which they dont always get. I hope something changes in their mechanic to make it easier to work.

[CountTalabecland]

The classes are balanced fine as they are.

The massive amount of ST dmg available through dots, especially for sorc, are more than a fair trade for the escape tools they have.

The dmg burst for both classes would need to be nerfed if they became harder to catch.

The "Massive" damage you are talking about only applies to unguarded players without a healer to cleanse. Any good team will just cleanse and absorb your damage. Now you are left with a wet noodle who dies when touched and self damages.

With ranked coming out and having BIS gear, jewels, event slot etc I think its time to help Sorc/BW as they are the only classes that cant effectively play ranked.

The Damage is good enough for group play. Sorc/BW are very good in ranked. Sure the time stamp isn't as easy as it is against solo pugs but what isn't? A good team has the tools to negate any classes damage unless you coordinate to create an opening where you can hit with burst and get a kill. That works that way for every DPS. Burst coordination on a unguarded target (via tank punt) and with healer compromised as well is how you get kills. There is no reason why BW/Sorc should not have to coordinate the same way to get their rotation off effectively. I've seen it done and as a Slayer/IB main I get hit by sorcs all the time and can confirm that the burst is there. Playing WP/RP its the same way, you have to be attentive and use the cleanse/absorb conservatively.

Now when it comes to kiting, Order has one class that can catch you, WL, along with ASW but who is way squishy. BW has to deal with a lot more in terms of pulls and knockdowns but that's mostly because destro brings comps that are ready to pressure RDPS. As Slayer, a good sorc can probably kite me as I have one snare break and one charge. So if Order wants to easily catch RDPS they have to plan for it just like destro. Cleanses are limited and so are absorbs and each comp has to think about how many they have. If they save them for sorc/bw, then they wont have it for the other DPS attacking them. IMO its a fair trade off. The sorc/BW threat is such that you can't ignore it and have to plan to cleanse it or throw out absorbs, which takes a decent amount of skill to do and is far from brainless play.

In regard to BW/Sorc timestamp/burst rotation the balance is really pretty square. Not everybody needs to be a kite class.

[Caduceus]

I think it is important to emphasize that there are very strong indiciations that something is wrong with ST BW/Sorc. It is clearly evidenced by the performance of these classes in Ranked SCs.

Agree with this, Ranked Solo stats make grim reading for BW/Sorc. Maybe the bomb AoE spec works, but does require a lot of careful healing and guard, which they dont always get. I hope something changes in their mechanic to make it easier to work.

AoE builds will not work; you need every ounce of ST burst you can get to secure kills.

The issue with BW/Sorc is not team support. In ranked most players will know their roles and play them with some competency. The issue is how easily BW/Sorc is pressured into ineffectiveness. Once they are caught, they have no real escape tools and they cannot fight.

Sorc/BW are very good in ranked.

This claim is not supported by the leaderboards.

[MedV]

The classes are balanced fine as they are.

The massive amount of ST dmg available through dots, especially for sorc, are more than a fair trade for the escape tools they have.

The dmg burst for both classes would need to be nerfed if they became harder to catch.

The "Massive" damage you are talking about only applies to unguarded players without a healer to cleanse. Any good team will just cleanse and absorb your damage. Now you are left with a wet noodle who dies when touched and self damages.

With ranked coming out and having BIS gear, jewels, event slot etc I think its time to help Sorc/BW as they are the only classes that cant effectively play ranked.

The Damage is good enough for group play. Sorc/BW are very good in ranked. Sure the time stamp isn't as easy as it is against solo pugs but what isn't? A good team has the tools to negate any classes damage unless you coordinate to create an opening where you can hit with burst and get a kill. That works that way for every DPS. Burst coordination on a unguarded target (via tank punt) and with healer compromised as well is how you get kills. There is no reason why BW/Sorc should not have to coordinate the same way to get their rotation off effectively. I've seen it done and as a Slayer/IB main I get hit by sorcs all the time and can confirm that the burst is there. Playing WP/RP its the same way, you have to be attentive and use the cleanse/absorb conservatively.

Now when it comes to kiting, Order has one class that can catch you, WL, along with ASW but who is way squishy. BW has to deal with a lot more in terms of pulls and knockdowns but that's mostly because destro brings comps that are ready to pressure RDPS. As Slayer, a good sorc can probably kite me as I have one snare break and one charge. So if Order wants to easily catch RDPS they have to plan for it just like destro. Cleanses are limited and so are absorbs and each comp has to think about how many they have. If they save them for sorc/bw, then they wont have it for the other DPS attacking them. IMO its a fair trade off. The sorc/BW threat is such that you can't ignore it and have to plan to cleanse it or throw out absorbs, which takes a decent amount of skill to do and is far from brainless play.

In regard to BW/Sorc timestamp/burst rotation the balance is really pretty square. Not everybody needs to be a kite class.

BE/Sorc is good in ranked?!? If they are good what classes do you think are worse ? Honest Question.

[Atropik]

The guy is obviously trolling, ranked scoreboard has 10 bw with the best stat of 3-3 and 4 pages of slayers

[Asherdoom]

honestly i abandoned my sorc rr 78 and started magus time ago. I specced hijm on demo path (riftstorm) build full tank and running with my guildies wb. is **** hilarious see order dps jumping on you and realize youre tankier than most classes (thoughness+ini+guard help) and while i riftstorm melee dps got time to mop up. I loved sorc and i played it since here was capped at t1 but the total disregard for the class is embarassing at best.

[Mez]

Class balance suggestions for the whole game to try improve ranked pops. This thread is what I hate most.