Bane Shield (less-so Discordant Fluctuation)

[Detangler]

AdamtheLC had the best suggestion. If you equip DireShielding it shortens the hell out of the duration instead of adding to it. Test that for a few days. If still too overpowered, restrict to WB and allow the duration back, test etc.

Would be willing to help test of course.

You’re right though, will be rubbish any other way.

There are a lot of "tweaks" that can be done/tested....you can make to grp restriction and tweak the effect: since chosen is a tank, what about to give the % dmg reflected as a mitigation => like misdirection M1 from casters but with a lower % value. Only for grp and only if tactic is slotted (of course)....this will not bring a massive aoe backlash and give a low amount of magic mitigation for your group, something that will be "intended" as a support class...

It sounds like they have already decided what tweak they are going to make. Instead of just viewing the high thorn damage as a byproduct of the AoE cap that makes BW so strong, they are going to arbitrarily decide which abilities have a 24 cap and which have less.

Mindlessly spamming Rain of Fire = ok. Mindlessly using Bane Shield = not ok. Since that would interfere with the BW Rain of Fire spam and they wouldn't be able to use funnel power to hurt themselves for more obscene damage. Bane Shield needs to be low impact enough so people can continue to spam AoE and essentially ignore it.

Kind of a smart ass comment, but it seems like only one side of whats really happening is being taken into consideration.

And I am only bringing up BWs because that was what was presented in the OP. Sorcs and Magus do they same thing as BWs, they just aren't as good at it.

I'm not saying they need to lower the AoE cap, but this seems like a situation where they are nerfing somethings AoE cap to protect the ability of other classes to exploit the AoE cap. Which to me is a little goofy.

Bright wizards also don't wear heavy armor, hence the diffentiation between the two. Reflecting back up to 600 damage a second in extreme situations on a tank isn't super strong. Reflecting back up to 2400 damage a second in extreme situations is a bit too much. This also doesn't mean that other chosens combined can't total up more dire shield procs to similar amounts.

But don't worry, the irony isn't lost on many people that engineers and BWs are complaining in this thread about the "dumb fire and forget" buff of dire shielding while in the same breath complaining that their fire and forget damage abilities aren't able to endlessly spam damage on keep funnels anymore.

[emiliorv]

Spoiler:

There are a lot of "tweaks" that can be done/tested....you can make to grp restriction and tweak the effect: since chosen is a tank, what about to give the % dmg reflected as a mitigation => like misdirection M1 from casters but with a lower % value. Only for grp and only if tactic is slotted (of course)....this will not bring a massive aoe backlash and give a low amount of magic mitigation for your group, something that will be "intended" as a support class...

It sounds like they have already decided what tweak they are going to make. Instead of just viewing the high thorn damage as a byproduct of the AoE cap that makes BW so strong, they are going to arbitrarily decide which abilities have a 24 cap and which have less.

Mindlessly spamming Rain of Fire = ok. Mindlessly using Bane Shield = not ok. Since that would interfere with the BW Rain of Fire spam and they wouldn't be able to use funnel power to hurt themselves for more obscene damage. Bane Shield needs to be low impact enough so people can continue to spam AoE and essentially ignore it.

Kind of a smart ass comment, but it seems like only one side of whats really happening is being taken into consideration.

And I am only bringing up BWs because that was what was presented in the OP. Sorcs and Magus do they same thing as BWs, they just aren't as good at it.

I'm not saying they need to lower the AoE cap, but this seems like a situation where they are nerfing somethings AoE cap to protect the ability of other classes to exploit the AoE cap. Which to me is a little goofy.

Bright wizards also don't wear heavy armor, hence the diffentiation between the two. Reflecting back up to 600 damage a second in extreme situations on a tank isn't super strong. Reflecting back up to 2400 damage a second in extreme situations is a bit too much. This also doesn't mean that other chosens combined can't total up more dire shield procs to similar amounts.

But don't worry, the irony isn't lost on many people that engineers and BWs are complaining in this thread about the "dumb fire and forget" buff of dire shielding while in the same breath complaining that their fire and forget damage abilities aren't able to endlessly spam damage on keep funnels anymore.

Wear heavy armor means nothing VS magic damage....lets talk about risk/reward: casters behind a wall dropping countless aoe spells in a choke point VS tank into funnel getting dmg from everyone.

[wraithghost]

This skill destroys grenade engis as well as soon as napalm goes down they just need to sit in it and we kill ourselves without major healing.

[adamthelc]

I dont think the armor of the chosen is relevant. But the argument that one damage is being spread while the other is all ST is valid. That's why I already made some suggestions earlier.

The duration is too long, it shouldn't just be a huge damage damage ability for the chosen it should be something that has to be used at the right time and if the BW, or whatever class, ignores it or isn't aware of it they should be punished.

It would be one thing if the damage was too much to deal with, but funnel power deals half the damage of bane shield and I'm sure some BWs still find a way to use that and stay alive.

I do think dire shielding is overturned, I just don't agree with the way they are fixing it. Like has already been said, if you bring it down to a level that it can be ignored what's the point? Its just a little bit of extra damage, which seems lackluster and boring IMO.

[Gottschalt]

Aw man, as Knight main, when I took a look of the bane shield and its tactic.. I was like "HOLY, That is useful!"

Guess it is.
Also, bane shield is enchancement. Knight has enhancement removal, so has few other classes.
Perhaps the thing here is to stop nuking if it hurts yourself and direct those enchancement removers to do their job?

[Detangler]

Spoiler:

It sounds like they have already decided what tweak they are going to make. Instead of just viewing the high thorn damage as a byproduct of the AoE cap that makes BW so strong, they are going to arbitrarily decide which abilities have a 24 cap and which have less.

Mindlessly spamming Rain of Fire = ok. Mindlessly using Bane Shield = not ok. Since that would interfere with the BW Rain of Fire spam and they wouldn't be able to use funnel power to hurt themselves for more obscene damage. Bane Shield needs to be low impact enough so people can continue to spam AoE and essentially ignore it.

Kind of a smart ass comment, but it seems like only one side of whats really happening is being taken into consideration.

And I am only bringing up BWs because that was what was presented in the OP. Sorcs and Magus do they same thing as BWs, they just aren't as good at it.

I'm not saying they need to lower the AoE cap, but this seems like a situation where they are nerfing somethings AoE cap to protect the ability of other classes to exploit the AoE cap. Which to me is a little goofy.

Bright wizards also don't wear heavy armor, hence the diffentiation between the two. Reflecting back up to 600 damage a second in extreme situations on a tank isn't super strong. Reflecting back up to 2400 damage a second in extreme situations is a bit too much. This also doesn't mean that other chosens combined can't total up more dire shield procs to similar amounts.

But don't worry, the irony isn't lost on many people that engineers and BWs are complaining in this thread about the "dumb fire and forget" buff of dire shielding while in the same breath complaining that their fire and forget damage abilities aren't able to endlessly spam damage on keep funnels anymore.

Wear heavy armor means nothing VS magic damage....lets talk about risk/reward: casters behind a wall dropping countless aoe spells in a choke point VS tank into funnel getting dmg from everyone.

Sigh, OK so the hint wasn't picked up. Tank classes are meant to block/push a funnel, BW is meant to hide and do the pew pew damage. Its not risk/reward, its your class and its place in the game. You're doing the apples to oranges comparison. Reflecting back some damage is fine when wearing all that armor, toughness, and a shield spamming HTL. All that defense and reflecting massive damage all by yourself probably isn't the most balancing ability.

Look, I'm arguing against my own self interest here. You can see my sig. Its a bit too much as is right now, but we will see how it plays out when it's changed.

In the mean time, feel free to continue to test out how dire shielding works now until its fixed. You know... for science!

[Tarantoga]

its just to much. i am a destro player (chosen) myself aswell ,and chosen is the masterchief of wb, solo, smallscale and "solo in wb" scale aswell. kotbs is still great at beeing buff-/guardbot and wound debuff but the gap is to big imo. chosen still got dmg output (solo and wb)kotbs is just a buff and guard bot. leaving all other tanks out of consideration at all... Oo

[CeeJay89]

Spoiler:

There are a lot of "tweaks" that can be done/tested....you can make to grp restriction and tweak the effect: since chosen is a tank, what about to give the % dmg reflected as a mitigation => like misdirection M1 from casters but with a lower % value. Only for grp and only if tactic is slotted (of course)....this will not bring a massive aoe backlash and give a low amount of magic mitigation for your group, something that will be "intended" as a support class...

It sounds like they have already decided what tweak they are going to make. Instead of just viewing the high thorn damage as a byproduct of the AoE cap that makes BW so strong, they are going to arbitrarily decide which abilities have a 24 cap and which have less.

Mindlessly spamming Rain of Fire = ok. Mindlessly using Bane Shield = not ok. Since that would interfere with the BW Rain of Fire spam and they wouldn't be able to use funnel power to hurt themselves for more obscene damage. Bane Shield needs to be low impact enough so people can continue to spam AoE and essentially ignore it.

Kind of a smart ass comment, but it seems like only one side of whats really happening is being taken into consideration.

And I am only bringing up BWs because that was what was presented in the OP. Sorcs and Magus do they same thing as BWs, they just aren't as good at it.

I'm not saying they need to lower the AoE cap, but this seems like a situation where they are nerfing somethings AoE cap to protect the ability of other classes to exploit the AoE cap. Which to me is a little goofy.

Bright wizards also don't wear heavy armor, hence the diffentiation between the two. Reflecting back up to 600 damage a second in extreme situations on a tank isn't super strong. Reflecting back up to 2400 damage a second in extreme situations is a bit too much. This also doesn't mean that other chosens combined can't total up more dire shield procs to similar amounts.

But don't worry, the irony isn't lost on many people that engineers and BWs are complaining in this thread about the "dumb fire and forget" buff of dire shielding while in the same breath complaining that their fire and forget damage abilities aren't able to endlessly spam damage on keep funnels anymore.

Let's not kid ourselves and act like Magus and Sorc can't do the exact same thing. I suppose to Destro, Tzeentch's Firestorm, Pit of Shade, and Dissolving Mist don't exist when talking about Engineer or BW. While we're at it, let's neglect interactions of abilities like Glean Magic with Pit of Shade. But don't worry, while we don't vocalize it often, the irony isn't lost to us that you'd forget what abilities your realm has in the name of preserving your one button wonders.

Also, stop passing around misinformation about my screenshots. I'll update you, since 2 posts in must be difficult to read to. There's ONE Chosen doing over 3.5k damage in 3s with Bane shield alone. Not 2, 3, 4, 5, or so many like you claim. ONE. This thread was initially a complaint about Discordant Fluctuation AND Bane Shield, to which I observed Bane Shield being the issue, not Discordant Fluctuation.

I don't give a hot **** whether they nerf the AoE cap or not. But let's not pretend like it's okay for one realm to have anti AoE built into one bullshit skill and not the other. Hell, mirror it on Knight and I'll happily play mine and wait for the Destro "Shield of the Sun OP" whine threads that will inevitably show up due to ignorance of their own realm's abilities.

I'm content with Dire Shield being limited to groups. If Destro can achieve the same affect with proper organization, good on them. Glad the non-bias Destro can see that (to which I know you're advocating, dispute everything else).

[ghojinn]

Bane shield isn't overpowered 10 seconds learn to switch targets they fixed it so it worked,but i guess all you are going to hear is the bad players complaining.

[Tarantoga]

Bane shield isn't overpowered 10 seconds learn to switch targets they fixed it so it worked,but i guess all you are going to hear is the bad players complaining.