To give rdps CC before tanks should have been questionable

[drmordread]

Witch elf have range kd (max almost 50 feets ) and i think its undefeandable.

yup... Awesome when someone starts kiting on you and you kd them close in and kill.

[drmordread]

I am not saying Mythic designed the perfect game. But they came close to it. The only problems I have with CC are that the SW and SH have five (5) by rr80 that can be used in a correct order one after another and all 5 will work.
That is more cc than a tank.

Other than that, everything else is just fine.

One thing that everyone forgets is that WAR (when working properly) is meant to be a group / team game. What one toon lacks in abilities is made up by others in the group. This is not to say that solo play is not viable. Even though this is a team game, most classes can solo quite effectively if played correctly and the player uses terrain / map to their advantage.

The one place where class inequality is mostly evident is in duels. But then again WAR is not designed for dueling. Example; In a duel I can never beat a shamie / AM on my WH / WE. But when I am out ganking, I usually get them.

BW's and Sorcs are always easy meat when they are solo. Rarely, you will run into a player so good that you can not beat their BW or Sorc, but that is because the player is awesome, not because the class is OP.

[Tesq]

I also agree that kd upon disrupt can hardly be considered the same as an anytime kd on a target of your choice - that's a nonsense comparison in practical terms in terms of how you can utilize it

The 100 feet range knockdown is not OP because it exists. It is OP because it is on the melee class that has already the most utility.

i dont understand how a ranged kd on a melee classes could help the melee classes do more damage, also if it proc on disrupt. I think that 100% mara on server would like to loose that for 1 random slayer skill...

P.S. you need to ranged KD then come closer, that's mean you actually use the rKD to close the gap between you and your target while, KD should insted used to actualy disable the target from not move + not use skill, that mean that when you are near your target is actually able to heal or cc you/flee.
IF target = dps it mean it will be guarded in the time you came closer and he can attack/flee.
If target = tank no sense rKD him
If target =healer you still need to close the gap and pass 70% times trought 20+ ppl in rvr eviroment where the game is designed so far for a WBs VS WBs, and it will still be able to be guarded and being able to heal himself when you attack him cos KD were alredy finishedì( a WE/WH could just get better results strike from hide at that points)
The disrupt trigger prevent you from organize a coordination attack on that target. So still wonder how you should benefith from that.
Exept disrupt, KD, and then pull, who's result in your target when land being able to flee away.

[noisestorm]

literally 8 out of 10 Tesq posts make me giggle :>

Edit: Okok i coolded down now:
So let me explain you a simple situation tesq. Your marauder is running against some kiting Ranged Class. You can now pull the enemy which will lead him to either root you and run, or kick you and run. Once the 'escape' ir safety tool of the target is out, you simply can knockdown him again, charge and close the gap. Simply because 2-3 seconds are waaay enough for a charging Marauder to come close enoug and wreck the enemy in the process. If you seriously DONT see how a ranged knockdown is OP as ****, then pls dont _always_ try to lecture us on any stuff, or try to sugarcoat any sh*t you made up. For you all is fine as long as the UBER Kotbs gets his nerf huh?

Edit edit: Pretty much the same goes for WE, allthough she will init with a Stealth (similar example to having your target pulled directly at you). Sure a Disrupt _may_ seem a bit unreliable, but hell dont you believe it is as bad as you may think it is.

[Tesq]

One thing that everyone forgets is that WAR (when working properly) is meant to be a group / team game. What one toon lacks in abilities is made up by others in the group. This is not to say that solo play is not viable. Even though this is a team game, most classes can solo quite effectively if played correctly and the player uses terrain / map to their advantage.

yup that's why when i see a RKD on bw i call it bad design, cos cc alredy should be something put on tanks an not on dps, if you want make an exeption and put a cc on a rdp, at least don't put it on the actualy best rdps classes of that realm.
It's like said give more reason to only play BW, what can other rdps offer bw can't? rKD on bw it's a wrong design choice nothing will make change my mind about that.
Also a rKD put on a melee make no sense, and it become uselss when he trigger by disrupt. It could have sense on a tank thx to hold the line but even there it would be still less effective than any normal melee knockdown.

[Tesq]

literally 8 out of 10 Tesq posts make me giggle :>

Edit: Okok i coolded down now:
So let me explain you a simple situation tesq. Your marauder is running against some kiting Ranged Class. You can now pull the enemy which will lead him to either root you and run, or kick you and run. Once the 'escape' ir safety tool of the target is out, you simply can knockdown him again, charge and close the gap. Simply because 2-3 seconds are waaay enough for a charging Marauder to come close enoug and wreck the enemy in the process. If you seriously DONT see how a ranged knockdown is OP as ****, then pls dont _always_ try to lecture us on any stuff, or try to sugarcoat any sh*t you made up. For you all is fine as long as the UBER Kotbs gets his nerf huh?

Edit edit: Pretty much the same goes for WE, allthough she will init with a Stealth (similar example to having your target pulled directly at you). Sure a Disrupt _may_ seem a bit unreliable, but hell dont you believe it is as bad as you may think it is.

that's because you suppose to gank and not actually play in wb vs wb situation, i never see that happen in big fight where squigshy classes are usually behind a wall of all other ppl and mostly tanks. So even if you can close the gap 2 times you pretty kill nothing.
Ehi btw im no-one to tell that is not op if you think is op make it less op or put something other to it place.Just i see no benefith for my mara spend point in something not reliable ( need to disrupt) and not put those points in main path and do more damage/ take a better reliable skill. Also trigger effect need to used after 5 sec after the trigged.
About kobs etc, i dont wanna make a wall of text but am the first to admit if there is something to touch on chosen it's destinated for vicotry tactic.....so your point make no senso, what i wish is for a better balance, and not always hear every time, you play a chosen well that classes is op you have no problem etc.....
There are several CC x realm unabalnce issue in each and every tank, also i ALWAYS THINK that chosen/kobs should not have super punt as their role is a buffer.Then If the kobs is the more op tank in game that is not my fault. Also when there was some classes like Magus/engi - AM /SH i always give suggestion how to improve them in any official forum thread i red.

[noisestorm]

Well i wouldnt specc it either but solely the Existance of a ranged KD enables quite some chances for plays, that shouldnt be possible for melee classes in the first place. And im not even sure what you are talking about wb vs wb here?

Its offtopic anyways. Even though i dont know what message TenTon wanted to deliver here
Ranged Classes need some kind of 'shrug off' tools, else they simply get perma raped by Melees and the endless amount of slows (and later also the hardCC they will have). The Knockdown on the BW might sound strong for others 'compared' to the sorc, as well as some ppl crying over the self-cleanse, but i could argue the same way for the Sorcs %dmg buff or the undefendable instant Cast or the Selfheal which i wouldnt mind on BW either.

[Tesq]

Well i wouldnt specc it either but solely the Existance of a ranged KD enables quite some chances for plays, that shouldnt be possible for melee classes in the first place. And im not even sure what you are talking about wb vs wb here?

Its offtopic anyways. Even though i dont know what message TenTon wanted to deliver here
Ranged Classes need some kind of 'shrug off' tools, else they simply get perma raped by Melees and the endless amount of slows (and later also the hardCC they will have). The Knockdown on the BW might sound strong for others 'compared' to the sorc, as well as some ppl crying over the self-cleanse, but i could argue the same way for the Sorcs %dmg buff or the undefendable instant Cast or the Selfheal which i wouldnt mind on BW either.

yea but topic of the argument is , are suppose Classes have out of "their archtype" competence tools?
I' AM SUPER OK with bw being able to cleans(not with the fact that he take no damage for use fire on himself lol)this is just what make him unique when compare to sorc, but when you start give too much unique things and those are even cc ( and this is a rKD, 1 of best cc in game) on the best damage dealer of realm an allarm called op sounds in my head.

Sorc can be strong but he made only damage. BW actually pretty able to do too much things. If sorc made too much damage that's because of a bad scalign damage. If bw perform too well is because due to his range of option.
Still with no lotd weapons at rr80 all should be more balanced so i duno how usefull is talk about that now, before t4 is relased and classes are tested with no bug like it wasn't on official.

[drmordread]

Tesq, I have no problems at all with CC on other classes. It makes perfect sense, especially on weak no armor classes like stealth and rdps.

[Azarael]

I am not saying Mythic designed the perfect game. But they came close to it. The only problems I have with CC are that the SW and SH have five (5) by rr80 that can be used in a correct order one after another and all 5 will work.
That is more cc than a tank.

Other than that, everything else is just fine.

One thing that everyone forgets is that WAR (when working properly) is meant to be a group / team game. What one toon lacks in abilities is made up by others in the group. This is not to say that solo play is not viable. Even though this is a team game, most classes can solo quite effectively if played correctly and the player uses terrain / map to their advantage.

The one place where class inequality is mostly evident is in duels. But then again WAR is not designed for dueling. Example; In a duel I can never beat a shamie / AM on my WH / WE. But when I am out ganking, I usually get them.

BW's and Sorcs are always easy meat when they are solo. Rarely, you will run into a player so good that you can not beat their BW or Sorc, but that is because the player is awesome, not because the class is OP.

Swordmaster.

Thanks for playing.

In other news, giving all the fragile classes many tools to negate their own fragility while neglecting to allow the actual control classes to control the battlefield is not what I'd call near-perfect design.