Standpoint on addons ?.

[Diggot]

I remember from WAR that many addons were frowned upon by some players and holeheartedly
supported by some. Then there were addons which were outright cheat-programs like NB.

Personally i consider any addons which:

1) Shows buffs & debuffs on target.
2) Enables/disables use of abilities depending on targets buffs.
3) Allows for macroing abilities for auto-activation when allowed.

: are addons that should be considered an outright cheat and a bannable offense.

Addons that basically hands you important information about an enemy player
in a pvp-focused game shouldn't be allowed since it gives the player a HUGE advantage.

So what is the standpoint of such addons, according to the devs/GMs/people in charge of RoR ?.

[peterthepan3]

I remember from WAR that many addons were frowned upon by some players and holeheartedly
supported by some. Then there were addons which were outright cheat-programs like NB.

Personally i consider any addons which:

1) Shows buffs & debuffs on target.
2) Enables/disables use of abilities depending on targets buffs.
3) Allows for macroing abilities for auto-activation when allowed.

: are addons that should be considered an outright cheat and a bannable offense.

Addons that basically hands you important information about an enemy player
in a pvp-focused game shouldn't be allowed since it gives the player a HUGE advantage.

So what is the standpoint of such addons, according to the devs/GMs/people in charge of RoR ?.

Only NB has come under scrutiny (rightly so). All other addons are fair.

Showing buffs and debuffs on target is actually an integral part of many other MMOs (as in, buffs/debuffs above nameplates), so it's no surprise that most people who play RoR competitively use buffhead to make up for the fact that WAR (for some strange reason) doesn't have this option.

[Diggot]

One of the type of addons i'm highly against are the ones that
allows for advanced macros that reads your opponents buffs and
disables or enables the use of certain skills automatically in the macro
which in turn prevents the player from putting a skill on CD eventho
the target itself was immune to the ability.

Let's say that your target is immune to disarm, and you have disarm in
your macro. The addon would "read" that the target is immune to disarm
and prevent the skill from activating in the macro.

These types of addons basically allows the player from putting all their
abilities on 2 buttons and spam them, without consequezes or fear
of wasting the use of important abilities.

[Natherul]

One of the type of addons i'm highly against are the ones that
allows for advanced macros that reads your opponents buffs and
disables or enables the use of certain skills automatically in the macro
which in turn prevents the player from putting a skill on CD eventho
the target itself was immune to the ability.

Let's say that your target is immune to disarm, and you have disarm in
your macro. The addon would "read" that the target is immune to disarm
and prevent the skill from activating in the macro.

These types of addons basically allows the player from putting all their
abilities on 2 buttons and spam them, without consequezes or fear
of wasting the use of important abilities.

That would be one of the reasons NB is on the short list of addons that given a chance, broken.

[ragafury]

if you use nb like that:

Apply cc if target is not affected by unstoppable i bet my money that you still will get scrubbed.
Especially if you buff unstoppable with a disarm while having a tank next to you with a 3sec kd (which really hard ccs the target). (even with target class check enabled).

Imo you make better cc decisions manually by far.

Its not hard to add an aura checker for unstoppable and immovable and use cc in a way better fashion (silence secondary target aka healer) before applying burst.

What makes a difference is that you can implement on mara as an example perfect use of gutripper, guillotine and so on, so conditionals which normally require you to pay attention.

What's also too good is that you can basically script your dps rotation including debuffs, instants, hardcasts in one rotation and the addon makes "close" to perfect rotations if you script proper.
Close to perfect because the addon needs a quarter second to realize you standing still (mostly affects casters, but that way you can pay full attention to positioning, kiting etc.)

Not saying NB is not borderline, but the example given a top is pretty meh.

Idc pretty much if nb leaves the game, would be redundant imo.

The buff and debuff tracking is essential however, standard ui is just terrible in that regard. (it adds that feature already, showing buffs and debuffs, but in an unsorted, unaccessible way with 0 overview).

[saupreusse]

You would break the games only way to make up for its horribly broken and unfinished user interface if you were to remove addons like buffhead or enemy. The devs support buffhead and would like to integrate it into the game. Thats why the ror download came with buffhead preinstalled not too long ago. Its unreasonable to claim this addon should be removed.

[roadkillrobin]

The substantial things you could do on NB is something you can do on a macro keyboard anyway with some cleaver programing using the ICD as programing mechanic. Gutting NB would make macroing skills a economical factor. There wouldn't be a need of either If the skill system and class mechanics were better developed.

[Elemint]

A legendary player said it the best, so instead of just rephrasing i'll give it straight from the source:

Spoiler:

You know what, I posted all the no-no's and commented on them without ever saying why. I guess I do that all the time? Okay, so here's a fundamental reason why addons make you worse: Look at your target in squares, grid, etc. whatever have you - then look at the person far off in the distance that you're healing, or is being hard swapped on. You can't. Basically, your eyes can't be two places at once. Maybe your peripherals, but if you can use them to execute gaming you've got one up on me, lads.

That .5 seconds it took you to trace your eyes from your addons to your target/character is just enough of an amount of time for pro gamers to annihilate you. Don't believe me? Watch Fatal1ty videos for Unreal Tournament. Watch his reaction speed - you think you're alive? No, you're dead. And all because you took your eyes off the screen for half a second.

The point is, every time you take your eyes off of your character, target, or defensive target, you're basically blind. And sure, this may work for you up to a certain degree, and hey - this might not even rend you at a disadvantage on Warhammer, I'm sure it won't. But I promise you, if you ever hit high levels of gaming, you will not be able to afford taking your eyes off of critical situations - ever. This would only lead you to be headshot, swapped on, CC'd, etc. (this is why pros at every MMO level use target binds in addition to nameplates/healthbars, but that's a whole other story.)

Assist macros. You ever try to assist macro against a top .01% player world-wide? It doesn't happen. They're not hitting macros, folks. They're there in real time. They'll swap you 99 times without blinking an eye. Synergy is something extremely relevant to gaming. So you swap onto Sodahz - do you think reck/ven aren't going to immediately peel you? They're not using anything to guide them. It's instinct. So you might say, "well, they're the best players in the world", etc. etc. How do you think they got there? By crutching? No.

The other part is anticipation. Most if not all pros use anticipation in gaming, they're predicting your next move. The rogue Unmercey is famous for this - he's a Mrs. Cleo in pvp. That vanish blind? That shadowstep kidney? (yes, these are wow terms, apologies). They knew you'd do it. They knew the game so well and could first-glance your skill level based on how you moved, what you did, etc. , that they knew what you'd do before you even did it. There's thousands of evidence supporting this - go look them up. (watch how many times i detaunt you right before you kd me)

Can you use addons? Yes. Will it help the average player perform better? Yes. Will it be the direct correlation to you winning games? Yes. Will you ever beat the best players in the world with them? No. Is there a direct link between you using addons and you not being able to defeat the best players in the world? Yes.

That's the real answer. Take it as you will.

The clear question: How did reckful go 117-4 and 84-3 against the best players in the world with zero addons. Answer? Because he's #%*@ reckful.

If you're aiming for anything else, whilst striving to be a good gamer, you're aiming in the wrong direction, imho.

And if you don't care, grats. Don't care. It's just a video game - I gotcha. If you do care, listen and pay attention to what the best do. If i'm trying to be the best race car driver in the world i'm not going to check out what jimmy down the street does, I'm going to watch jeff gordon. do the same.

Yes, this was general, broadened knowledge of gaming, the post at hand at least. But due to the replies, i decided to comment. And i'm not going to sit here and lead you to becoming an average gamer - what's the point in that? I'm here to tell you the truth, because players often searching for advice - ironically in advice - will give you thousands of replies as to what they know. But what do they know? Not much, I assure you. And if you, at a glance, assume that their answer is the end-all-be-all, you've just stepped one step closer to being limited as to your potential. So, I guess, I'm here to dissuade that.

So why do I do this? Why do I post here? Why do I combat advice chat every day? It's not for me, friends. I could've been what I am with or without telling you. It's for you, honestly. It's because I know the next Beethoven of the gaming world is out there somewhere - and you know what? I want to see it. You might think i'm some arrogant asshole that's just here to tell you how mediocre i think you are - but that couldn't be further from the truth. The reality is, I want to see the future. I want to be amazed. I want to be in awe. Just like you might watch professional dancing or acting, I want to be moved. And I know you're there - the future, and perhaps reading this. I'm just some hopeless schmuck that hit my peak 10 years ago and never made enough money from gaming to buy groceries - so believe me, I know where I'm lacking.

And humbly, perhaps, you may cite me as your first step. I hope to be so lucky. Looking forward to meeting you.

Don't forget your elders