Why Beastlord for DoK have parry striketrough?

[Arena]

SC screenshots mean nothing.

And I wasn't saying that melee healers were useless. I was asking... specifically, which setup would they benefit the most from.

mdd dok can be used in any melee oriented group outside 2+2+2 standart.
Those are: premade groups (for example 2 choosens, 2 mdd doks, black guard, rdd shaman), friends parties (not as strong as premades, but those are most groups of randomly playing people around here), any melee oriented group with 1 deep def. shield tank as additional half damager and half healer, who can do both.
I can come up with doesens of party combinations, with an explanation of what every member should do, how whole party must move, how to choose targets. But what's the use, if every person in dev team think that mdd dok is useless and have to face irreversible changes.

[Leecifer]

Its hard to add any Melee WP/DoK to a 6man group without sacrificing something else.


I.E. If you have a melee healer in your party its harder to run 2 MDPS as all three will be hungry for guard. It also puts alot of stress on the ranged healer, if their melee train breaks off and dives healer and slows the melee WP/DoK there is going to be little to no healing to keep the ranged healer alive.

Their AOE healing is very good if you can keep the Melee WP on a MDPS, but any coordinated group worth their marbles will easily exploit the weaknesses of the Melee Healer, either with slows or a disarm.

That being said, when we have mixed in Cerenna into our 6man groups, we found it works best with 2 - 2 -2 setup with 1 melee healing WP and 1 AM. Sometimes the melee healing is good enough that the AM can focus on utility/moral pumping.

[Arena]

Its hard to add any Melee WP/DoK to a 6man group without sacrificing something else.


I.E. If you have a melee healer in your party its harder to run 2 MDPS as all three will be hungry for guard. It also puts alot of stress on the ranged healer, if their melee train breaks off and dives healer and slows the melee WP/DoK there is going to be little to no healing to keep the ranged healer alive.

Their AOE healing is very good if you can keep the Melee WP on a MDPS, but any coordinated group worth their marbles will easily exploit the weaknesses of the Melee Healer, either with slows or a disarm.

That being said, when we have mixed in Cerenna into our 6man groups, we found it works best with 2 - 2 -2 setup with 1 melee healing WP and 1 AM. Sometimes the melee healing is good enough that the AM can focus on utility/moral pumping.

There are many examples of 3 damagers groups around, and they doing well.
Disarm can be cleaned by DoK himself, so there is no problem with that.
Main problem is snares, and that is where tank must help with stagers, roots, snares etc. Also DoKs can heal even by striking tanks, because after snaring they try to run somewhere else and put theyre backs open to hit. Also DoK should watch his position all the time, so even if he rooted there must be option to choose some enemy to heal from.
P.S. Of course mdd dok must have resolut defence and lots of AP potions, it's out of discussion.

[Leecifer]

In my experience, a 2 - 2 - 2 premade will almost always beat out any non trinity group. Unless there is a large disparity in either teamwork or gear.

[Arena]

In my experience, a 2 - 2 - 2 premade will almost always beat out any non trinity group. Unless there is a large disparity in either teamwork or gear.

2011 year - my premade wins 100% scenarios, even against 2 premades.
We had: 2 mele doks, 2 mdd choosens, 1 mdd BG, 1 heal dok. That 3rd dok was since we start, that was in 2010, there was diffirent heal from damage mechanic back there, doks could heal in melee only for 10 feet around them, that why we use 3rd dok as healer - so he can stay with us all the time, and also heal if someone is left behind. It was hard, but when i teach and lead all of them we newer loose again. Our premade broke up in 2 months after 100rr patch was released and most of them leave the game. I stay and played in another friends group with unchanged build.
I agreed that 2+2+2 premades are easy to collect and effective, mostly because of that it almost always put together by everyone - easy to collect. Custom premades always stronger, but they usually harder to collect and lern to play.

[GodlessCrom]

Live meta was totally different though: different gear and abilities (bugged and otherwise) means almost everything was different. Also people were on average just worse at the game.

[Leecifer]

I stand by my opinion that no 2-2-2 team should lose against a non trinity premade. Thus, unless the melee healing WP can fit into a 2-2-2 team I dont see them getting alot of love in some serious 6v6s.

[Manatikik]

In my experience, a 2 - 2 - 2 premade will almost always beat out any non trinity group. Unless there is a large disparity in either teamwork or gear.

2011 year - my premade wins 100% scenarios, even against 2 premades.
We had: 2 mele doks, 2 mdd choosens, 1 mdd BG, 1 heal dok. That 3rd dok was since we start, that was in 2010, there was diffirent heal from damage mechanic back there, doks could heal in melee only for 10 feet around them, that why we use 3rd dok as healer - so he can stay with us all the time, and also heal if someone is left behind. It was hard, but when i teach and lead all of them we newer loose again. Our premade broke up in 2 months after 100rr patch was released and most of them leave the game. I stay and played in another friends group with unchanged build.
I agreed that 2+2+2 premades are easy to collect and effective, mostly because of that it almost always put together by everyone - easy to collect. Custom premades always stronger, but they usually harder to collect and lern to play.

I too like to use anecdotal evidence from six years ago to back up my arguments.

On a serious note though running melee healers is a liability because to be in position they have to be out of position for their role. No amount of pure healing numbers makes up for the fact that a rp/zealot in the back would be adding more to your group with safe heals, not eating a guard, not healing themselves to pad numbers, and a 6 second range stagger on an enemy healer.

[peterthepan3]

In my experience, a 2 - 2 - 2 premade will almost always beat out any non trinity group. Unless there is a large disparity in either teamwork or gear.

2011 year - my premade wins 100% scenarios, even against 2 premades.
We had: 2 mele doks, 2 mdd choosens, 1 mdd BG, 1 heal dok. That 3rd dok was since we start, that was in 2010, there was diffirent heal from damage mechanic back there, doks could heal in melee only for 10 feet around them, that why we use 3rd dok as healer - so he can stay with us all the time, and also heal if someone is left behind. It was hard, but when i teach and lead all of them we newer loose again. Our premade broke up in 2 months after 100rr patch was released and most of them leave the game. I stay and played in another friends group with unchanged build.
I agreed that 2+2+2 premades are easy to collect and effective, mostly because of that it almost always put together by everyone - easy to collect. Custom premades always stronger, but they usually harder to collect and lern to play.

Which worthy premades did you beat 6v6? 2011 WAR is completely different to RoR: I'd say that RoR actually had (atm not so much, but a year or so ago) a lot more competition, on average people are better here, and there aren't op gear/pocket items to rely on to make up for lack of skill.

[wargrimnir]

Not that it matters much, but we're not making changes to Dok/WP Beastlord. Find a way to use it, or don't, or wait til the melee changes it was intended to fit.