[DISCUSSION] RVR - likes/dislikes/possible improvement?

[trebla]

Those pug warbands of 21 dps, 2 healers and 1 tank do all the work locking zones.

6mans do nothing but gank soloers. That's how they get gold bags.

I noticed and said this weeks ago. The PUG wb does all the work. Runs supplies, Takes Contested BO's, FIghts at the Keep. Yet everyone in the PUG WB never out contributes the 6 man gank groups.

Is this the system we want?
6 mans ganking small groups, or kiting bigger groups half away across a zone or into PVE. They Take empty BO's half the time don't run supplies. Even worse on destro the 6 mans don't even communicate with the WB.
The game has turned into grief fest (maybe not that bad for all players). PUG WB's blaming 6 mans for not helping, 6 mans blaming WB cause they are PUGS and not in comms.

The solution simple. REDUCE all contribution from kills not made on a BO or KEEP.

CAMPING the WC within a certain radius rewards nothing. (no medallions, no Renown, NOTHING)

The faction that out numbers their enemy HAS NO ACCESS to siege after the keep is taken.

AND for the love of god, If your faction has AAO, the timer on BO should be lowered by the percentage. So BO cap has a hold timer of 3 min with 100% AAO. timer reduced by 10%.

Just food for thought.

PS I'm not sure if this right place to post this. Apologies to moderators in advanced.

[dansari]

The solution simple. REDUCE all contribution from kills not made on a BO or KEEP.

I don't think this would be good. You already get extra renown for fighting next to a keep or BO. To reduce the amount of contribution you earn would just mean fighting in open rvr would be frowned upon.

AND for the love of god, If your faction has AAO, the timer on BO should be lowered by the percentage. So BO cap has a hold timer of 3 min with 100% AAO. timer reduced by 10%.

I like this -- sometimes the timer seems super bugged on BOs and it makes no sense to have a 4min BO timer when it's 20v100 in a zone.

[th3gatekeeper]

The solution simple. REDUCE all contribution from kills not made on a BO or KEEP.

I think this is not a "simple solution" you think.

First, we don't 100% know how contribution works, so IMO trying to "peer into" what gives the most contribution is only going to be met with DEV frustration because they will say "thats not how contr. works, we arent going to disclose it".


Now, that said, we DO 100% know that things like supplies, ONLY give contribution for your party - not the warband.
We DO 100% know that in order to get "credit" for capping or defending a BO, you have to be in the area to get credit.

So these are things that IMO promote selfish play. If you were to modify contribution, so that it was warband wide, ZONE wide, it would be VERY difficult for 6 mans to compete with warbands who would likely have multiple people doing multiple things, giving the entire warband contribution.

For instance, 1 person running supplies, 1-2 groups recapping a BO while the other 1-2 groups capping another BO.
Versus the 6 man, likely all doing just 1 of those things.

This would favor warbands over 6 mans and promote working together to lock a zone. Right now, youll even have people "wait to cap" or selfishly, leave to another BO to hurry and try and ninja cap before the warband comes to get "extra" contribution. Its all selfish play.

If anyone gets contribution in the warband, it should be spread warband wide... ZONE wide - as long as you are in the lake, you get it.



AFKERs: Now this raises a problem. What about an AFKer sitting in the lake in a warband, he will get contribution.

Yup! And the warband leader has the ability to boot him, and lock the party (not make it public). So this is solved with a "pay attention to your warband"


Anyways, this would solve ONE aspect of the contribution system: The selfishness.

What it DOESNT solve, is the fact that you have a grou pof 20 guys running around and only a small % of that warband will get a top spot and have a "real" chance at good loot. But thats another issue...

[Aurandilaz]

now all of the textwalls above would not be required if capping BOs and helping in keep takes would actually held contribute towards earning end game gear instead of just creating a bigger pile of Soldiers and Officers medallions that currently serve little to no purpose once you have finishes with Annihilator...
The game is fugged up when the biggest struggle is not about defeating the enemy realm, but about competing with your own side for the killstealing and contri maximizing..

I'm not sure how old this saying is, but it is certainly old enough to be from live servers era: "T4 is where your dreams come to die"

[Tesq]

@gate mm not true if contribution would be spread all over wb it will then get divided for x ppl where x is the number of currently in wb ppl wen that single contribution is recived every time with every person have a individual contribution.

You are six you pick fights for 6 and contribution get divided by 6, you are 20 contribution you get get divided by 20.
WB wil sure get other wb aswell and will also gank smaller group, smaller group otherwise can help in wb fight by st focus and get more db and or do smaller skirmish and get lower kill but they count more; it's all a matter of divisions here and there.

(BTW all this supply stuff, i won all my bags by stay in zone for long and run max 2 suppl as chosen...i dont get why ppl consider supply so much important, die for sure mean nothing dosen't matter how many times you die it's is much more imp be top kill; if you are top kill it dosen't matter if the second have half your death ....you will win a gold and he will win a purple. )

[th3gatekeeper]

@gate mm not true if contribution would be spread all over wb it will then get divided for x ppl where x is the number of currently in wb ppl wen that single contribution is recived every time with every person have a individual contribution.

You are six you pick fights for 6 and contribution get divided by 6, you are 20 contribution you get get divided by 20.
WB wil sure get other wb aswell and will also gank smaller group, smaller group otherwise can help in wb fight by st focus and get more db and or do smaller skirmish and get lower kill but they count more; it's all a matter of divisions here and there.

(BTW all this supply stuff, i won all my bags by stay in zone for long and run max 2 suppl as chosen...i dont get why ppl consider supply so much important, die for sure mean nothing dosen't matter how many times you die it's is much more imp be top kill; if you are top kill it dosen't matter if the second have half your death ....you will win a gold and he will win a purple. )

Right, so rather than divide that by the # of players, give ALL players the same amount.... So you WONT divide by 20 vs divide by 6.... Problem solved.

[trebla]

if you are top kill it doesn't matter if the second have half your death ....you will win a gold and he will win a purple.

This is what I'm talking about. Why we don't know the exact formula, we DO know that the 6 man premades with top kills in zone are always on top of contribution.'

The same premades who you never see run supplies, you never see on a RAM or a Siege weapon, the same premades that don't hold BO's for stupid timers, or attack lord or oil. ALL these things that are most vital to flipping a zone if done all should contribute WAY more than kills outside a warcamp or in empty RVR nowhere near objective (ganking).]

So the formula is not clear, but means to top it IS.

[drmordread]

Time has come to stop favoring organized 6 man groups and start working on boosting the power of pugs.
Ever since the system started relying on numbers to kill the Lord, run supplies, etc, 6 man guild groups rarely do anything. If I had a conq medallion for every time they take a bo but do not run supplies, i would have full conq set of gear.
Not saying all, but most, just dont care about anything. not the realm, not the zone, not even anyone, not in their little six man world.
So they run around, ganking solo players at 6 to 1 odds in their favor, and because of the insane amount of kills they get, they get the bags too.

This game was built for pugs. In all games, it i the pug wb/grp that does 80% of the work. Time to find a way to reward that!

PS Just change the lock zone reward from Anni medalions to Conq, and the problems with loot rolls, participation, etc, will be solved.

[Dabbart]

yep... 6mans only ever fight 6v1, never run Supplies, never try to fight the zerg, never defend the keep/attack, never do a damned thing. And yet they are the ones gaining top contribution...

Jesus, and I thought I was good at Trolling....

[roadkillrobin]

You do find the 6man groups that runs in rvr spending ALOT of their time at the oposing warcamp. So what are they doing there if not farming soloers? I'm not saying they are getting the top contribution, coz they almoast never do when i run with our warband. But helping progressing the campain they are not and getting loads of medalions they are. So the system is rewarding this kinda playstyle, were you can pretty much ignore the objetives of the campain and still get ALOT of personal progression without pulling much weight to the rest of your realm.