BG buffs to be more inline with IB?

[GodlessCrom]

Issue the first: you don't understand how to read English, and so you don't actually know what the tooltips say. Enraged Beating is 283 damage every half second, aka 566 damage every second, for 3 seconds. Grudge-born Fury is 520 damage over three seconds (these are only the tooltips on the Career Builder IIRC, actual damage at r40 is different). So you're literally just wrong about everything there: Enraged Beating has HIGHER base damage than Grudge-Born Fury, not lower. It can also be used with snb, not just 2her, and furthermore, its main purpose IIRC is to build Hate, not necessarily do a massive amount of damage.

As Bloodi pointed out, you're completely wrong about Binding Grudge: it only has a DoT component, no direct damage.

Almost no one specs for Grudge-Born Fury because, quite simply, it doesn't do all that much damage at current gear levels and to spec for it, you need to give up important abilities in the other two trees (mainly Brotherhood, which has a preponderance of the good abilities a 2h IB will need to be useful in group).

Oathstone: again, don't know that many Ironbreakers that spec for it, since you generally wanna go higher in the Brotherhood tree. And even so, the damage is notoriously unreliable since it's based on whomever hits you, so if you have mutiple targets hitting you, there is no guarantee it will do damage to the person you want. It's a decent survivability cooldown due to the block, but that's it. Also, mostly useless in 1v1 if enemy has a decent Buffhead set up cuz they will just see the buff and kite away while its up.

So I have to ask: do you actually play the game, or just misread tooltips online and come to the forums to complain?

[Lektroluv]

Can tell me the area snare damage do not scale with grudge too? the area snare is not in third path instead of central one either? is the self heal in another tree too? you have to specialize in 3 paths for a viable build like balckguards? doesn't your chaneled hiting ability scale crit based on grudges, while blackguard do not give any crit boost?

Can you tell me why the IB KD is not 5 secs? Why cant we debuff a target to make everyone that hits it get 10% crit instead of spending a gdc to give 10% crit to one guy in our group? Why does BG get a wounds debuff and IB doesnt?

Why the **** are you directly comparing some mirror skills without getting the whole picture? Why i am even replying to you when you already shown with your various "engineers are so op and SH are the worst thing in any game ever" that you are a waste of anyones time? Why is there so many questions and so little time left of this year?

Again, stop reading tooltips, you get half of them wrong and you dont understand the game at all to get anything valuable of it. just stop it.

Dude i would trade those stupid 5 seconds and make them 3seconds for a full time avaiable KD, not needing block first

I would trade the change in area snare from central path to third one and scaling damage with hate like IB does , for make us finally able to use only 2 paths intead of 3, if we wanna go 2h tanks

Can we trade the 25% parry on you and your oathfriend for the 600armour buff which doesn't stack with potion too?

Can we have the 20% more crit on chaneled ability and the base damage? not half damage and none crit chance?

Are you seriusly comparing 2 seconds KD not available when you need it, with all that?

Stop fooling around seriusly, play your 20 times better designed order toon and stop complaining about players which only want a minimal balance.

[Lektroluv]

Ok perfect all good, i wonder why there is none hight rank blackguard, why the 90% of the persons which played game said blackguard was worse than IB.

I am sure you are all right, and the game is ok and this classes are balanced, have fun.

[Azarael]

Lektroluv is banned from posting in this topic.

[Beardypete]

Are not half the IB buffs overridden by other things? I know the armor and strength buff we can hand out are trumped by potions and also I believe knights. We are the worst faction tank too. On the other hand I cannot think of a potion that matches the black guards crit ability.

[GodlessCrom]

Our armor buff is better than the potion buff if you put even a few points into Brotherhood. So is the strength buff. The strength buff will be better than the kotbs buff if you go high enough to grab Earthshatter because very few knights to higher than encouraged aim in the 2h tree.

[Jaycub]

IB doesn't have to contend with the almighty morale pump like IB does.

I can guarantee you if you swapped BG over to order, and IB over to destro, IB would never be used just like BG is now. BG would see use in the same way IB does on order as a tank used in groups that need a strong armor debuff but lack WL. With the nerfs to WL I think WH/Slayer melee trains are certainly up there. We also seen the SW/Slayer DPS combo to combat proc groups which ran IB for armor debuff as well.

Problem with destro is BO has armor debuff, morale pump, and a host of other nice toys not to say BG is without them, but as tenton said other meta classes already cover what BG does but better in a lot of cases.

BG just needs a tweak or two like the ones we have seen, and the other 2 tanks on destro need to be addressed in the same way knight has on order.

Maybe theres some new meta down the line because of other changes, but as it stands now and what I can possibly foresee in the future any destro group wanting to tryhard is never gonna run BG over the other 2 in any fathomable group setup.

[7rere7]

What could be lacking for class balance, specially the Blackguard ,is outside tactics that hardly get used because they are very weak and pointless to slot.
All tactics should be tempting to spec ,this would lesson the strain of class comparison & competition debate .

Tactics:

1.Alignment with naggaroth.
I think this tactic applies for all tanks . It buffs one specific resistance at 260 .
Instead ,universal buff all resistance at 160 .

2. Bathing in Blood. Need a huge heal bonus for a Death blow ,maybe x2 or 3 as much.
Since Focused offence has been recently brought to attention for discussion balance, this tactic might pair good with BiB.

3.Crush Vitality.
Shouldn't this tactic debuffs target enemy at -50% auto attack speed rather then -20% ?
That tactic also needs a 25% chance for debuff to trigger.
Hastened Doom gives BG a 50% auto attack speed buff ,including wound debuff.

4.Dark Blessing
A 10% increase on all heals casted . This tactic is garbage the Sword Master has a 20% increase in all healing . The Blackguard increase 25% on cast heals sounds better.

5. Efficient Slaughter
All abilities expend hate cost 10 less to use ,rather then 5 .

6. Malekirths Bulwark
A 15% damage reduction against magic but -15% less healing received. This tactic is lacking depth because Order has two spell casters,(BW / AM) and Destruction has 3,( Sorc/Magus/Sham).
Shield of Anger tactic is high on Anguish path but 30% disrupt at 90 hate ,seems superior then Malekirths Bulwark.
The Black Orc "Savin my Hide " ability : 20% magic damage reduction and a toughness buff . The only downside to the ability its available on the best plan and magic buff is only 4 sec duration.
Magic damage reduction to 25% .

[bwdaWAR]

What could be lacking for class balance, specially the Blackguard ,is outside tactics that hardly get used because they are very weak and pointless to slot....

Alignment of Naggaroth, Bathing in Blood and Dark Blessing are racial tactics. All Dark Elves get them.

[7rere7]

What could be lacking for class balance, specially the Blackguard ,is outside tactics that hardly get used because they are very weak and pointless to slot....

Alignment of Naggaroth, Bathing in Blood and Dark Blessing are racial tactics. All Dark Elves get them.

Obviously "Dark Blessing " tactic would be to strong for the DOK .