Changelog 08/11/16

[normanis]

Spoiler:

all order nerf is because , order was ruling t4 all time . so now ppl log destruction and destruction for some time will rule t4. its short and simple.

Don't make ridiculous posts like this one - Penril.

[Noergl]

The issue with the morale is more the damage and debuff it provides in the current state of the game. On Live you had more HP and armor...so 1 cannon smash did not have the same impact it does now.

But if that´s the problem and it needs a change, wouldn´t it be more plausible to nerf that special morale instead of reducing the overall range, which has consequences for a lot more skills than only one m3?
I´m no hero in theocrafting, i admit that. I just want to understand the reasoning behind the changes. I gladly accept any kind of nerf or buff, i´m prepared to play with experimental rules, have changes and such. It´s Alpha, I know. But for me personally I find it a lot easier when i have a vague idea why something is this way or changed that way. And i still don´t get this one. If someone can explain it, i would be thankful.

[adei]

Thank you for your work.
Please be carefull with dok/wp mechanics, this little change is pushing them a little bit away from group style of playing.
Half-heal and half-dps now gonna have less heal and more dps, which means they became less valueable for group. Doks will save they're group playing style by prefering Pillage Essence, but it gonna make them weaker in compare with WPs. And i mentioned about they're ballance here:viewtopic.php?f=15&t=17726
Thank you for the patch once again. Please be carefull.

Everything you stated is false. Lets take a look and disect it shall we. First of all I will be using the DoK as an example considering WP has nothing like PE, which in essence means nothing about this change is a negative to WP, the trees available to them are so lackluster that even implying they could rival DoK with such a change is a joke.

Now to WA - Its a 13pt skill that nobody should have ever taken unless they wanted to ramp some points into the torture tree, why is this? PE is both a steroid to your SE and it also beat WA on damage, even with the execute status. Now, how does this have any impact on the current DoK class. If you play sac, it doesn't, therefore you maintain the healing from TE, RS, devour etc etc and nothing about your build will change. But what if you wanted to play DoK as a more of a melee dps in a larger group, specing WA did nothing for you, were as now it will act more like a brutality marauder, you have that reliability that when you can WA, its going to at least pack some form of a punch, as previously if it did not crit it was almost a wasted gcd, which is ad.

You can compare this to CS vs TE, what is CS you ask? why its cleave soul of course, the ability you start off as a DoK that you throw away when the godly TE comes into your life. It does the same damage and it heals you, why would you ever use CS? Same applies to PE vs WA, why would you ever taken WA over PE when PE gives you a steroid and the same damage. With this change it actually gives you a reason, both increased damage and guaranteed crit makes it both reliable and a more worthy 13 pt ability.

There is nothing to add here for melee WP, they need help and this is in the right direction, solid change.

This change does nothing for WP only potentially buffs DoK. I think there is't single WP in entire RoR that use Path of Wrath so deep to use HoS. if you going to improve WP melee capabilities you need firstly fix whole skills tree. However, your priority should be to improve WP melee heal abilities and Path of Grace not dps.

Im not going to repeat myself again, but the same principle applies, melee WP has now received a buff that gives them a worthy 13 pt ability, you spec in wrath so you can at least pack some sort of punch, considering your healing is worse than DoK due to abilities such a devour, SS is a joke and we all know it.

[hazzord]

I did not understand the changes on Engi range at all?

Are there any proposals on the Balance Discussion Forum on this matter? We got now an the huge imbalance between Engi and Magi (Range for Charakter and the Pet).

I did not get the point why people think there was an desisive difference between Magi and Engi after the latest changes. The last Day more decent Magi-Players reached the t4-Area and showed the potential to this class. I could tell you there is not a more noticeable difference between the to classes if the are played with the right rotation at ST mastery tree.

Also it sadly seems that, with missing proposals on Balance Discussion Forums about Engi-Range/Damage pp., complaining and whineing (mostly from known destro-mdps-players) seems to be the key to push your agenda trough. I remind about Aza told in an other threat that nothing would change without an justified proposal...

Afther this changes i have to realise that it sadly isnt even worth time to spend in Balance Discussion. Compaints seems to be more efficient.

regards

[Soulcheg]

That's some strange way of balancing sides, but meh, noone care what i think.

Btw, Penril is a global moderator now?

[Karast]

The change with snipe is looking nice. It feels good as a 13 point. I really like this change from a mastery spec point of view.

But I am against having there be a huge difference in ranges between engi and magus.

The mechanics need to be mirrored as closely as possible. The difference in range now is extremely noticeable and the changes should be done to both, or neither.

I do not like the idea of changing a mechanic to balance a single ability. If there is a problem with an ability, then the ability should be changed, not the mechanic.

If morale 2 and cannon smash are issues when it comes to engi / magus balance, then we need to look at those abilities, but morale 2 has already been dealt with, and cannon smash is a morale 3, and as such is where it should be power-wise. Unless all direct damage morales need adjustment.

The issue with engi / magus right now is an image issue. Engi was a more popular class than magus before the changes, and there were many more dedicated engi's around trying to make the class work. Engi's are also popular on the role-playing scene, which means there were much more engi's around to take advantage of the changes. It has taken a little while for the magus population to catch up, and figure out their builds and play-styles.

I'd really ask this question to those complaining about engi balance. How many order premades run an engi in their roaming / scenario setups? Not many, and there are many, many reasons why that is.

[tomato]

Engineer
- EXPERIMENTAL: The maximum range increase is 25% rather than 40%.

After playing a couple of scenarios on my engineer, this feels like an overkill. Engineer's range was just fine. I think the nerf was way too much and unnecessary, considering magus is still allowed to keep all his buffs.

[Azarael]

At the moment I plan to undo the Engineer range change, because it was done primarily because of Cannon Smash, and I have confirmed that Cannon Smash has 100ft range on the server. The server will block any attempt to use Cannon Smash past 100ft.

[Oldschool]

First of all - THANK YOU FOR YOUR GOOD WORK TO ALL THE DEVS AND ROR INVOLVED PEOPLE WHO ARE MAKING US PLAYERS HAPPY TO PLAY WAR AGAIN !!!
Many thanks for your time and Money you invest in this Project!
Its a gift and present for me and I take care of your work cause you give me very nice hours back of my lost Fantasy world!

Regarding the changes, your da Boss and I have to take all what you serve to me, but dont Forget the love for the marauders

[Renork]

Back near release...it was an amazing ability. But it has been fluff for a long time...I can't say I agree with these changes but I'll continue to play my gimp class and enjoy it.

You could argue that every ability in this game was overly godly near release since not a lot of people knew the basics of the game, lacked armor, resists, etc... you could spam cleave soul on a DoK and things would die.

Magus is now "officially" a stationary dps class and is far from being gimped at this point. My personal preference was to orient the class towards utility but having BoC on a 5cd and a total of 40% extra damage + 40% extra range means that the class should not receive any more significant buffs (plus demons are working as intended now). Believe me, If crit was easier to access, then people would not be happy with the magus class :^)

Stationary DPS...seems like an invalid argument for an archetype that is not useful in any other place other than on a keep wall. There aren't many fights where you sit still the entire time and magus is always a prime target so you have to move to stay alive or to kill. I don't care enough to post a long argument in the balance forum to buff magus nor do I need buffs to play my class efficiently...and I usually test my builds 100x in a style that works for me. I work with what I have and I always have. If magus is so amazing, why are there still so few? Of those few, why are there are only a few worth mentioning at all? You can , literally, swap ANY rdps for a better return than you get from magus. The damage and range was never an issue with magus imho...it's the lack of utility in a so-called utility class.

1. 2 GCDs and a tactic slot for an "instant" KD
2. Morale 1 for a range snare - melee snare is fun but not useful since you are snared if you are in range of, pretty much, any class
3. No heal debuff
3. 2 second cast disarm
4. 3 second cast for burst damage...BOC should be 3...but that is it
5. The added anti stagger buff they received on live is generally useless right now - and I actually used it on live.

Changes to any of those (no not all) would make a better impact imo. Don't get me wrong...I'm not crying. I just disagree with the changes...leave it at that.

I also disagree with the range change to engi...but I'm not going to go into all of that.

I don't disagree with you, stationary fights are not very common outside of keep fights. I never petitioned for a damage buff or range increase; rather I advocated for utility but a different route was taken and ultimately it made the class even more stationary. However, the damage/range buff was/is quite significant, so it would be rather hard to justify giving the class anything else. There are several reasons why people don't play the class....such as looks, some people don't like to be stationary, bad stigma, not good at 6v6 fights (again, stationary, w/little utility) etc... The class is by no means perfect, but if we had sovereign, people would be crying about getting killed "too fast" by magi. The burst potential is quite significant, especially if you have 8 ticks.

People whine more about engies because the turrets have the armor debuff (not an insignificant amount either). On live it was the other way around due to how easy it was to stack armor. It's always interesting to see how different the game is without LOTD (no one, literally almost no one complained about pounce, people were too busy getting murdered by torment spamming wh's).