Patchnotes 20/09/16

[Azarael]

Would be nice if the dynamics of the bo lock system could be modified with AAO / DR, where the underdog side stands a better chance to cap a bo or two. In almost every zone a wb/zerg can get to atleast 3 bo's before the 3 min timer is up from either keep.

Implementing this as we speak. Morf suggested it internally a few days ago.

[Bozzax]

Why not drop all the timers?

The strategy and tactics of guerrilla warfare tend to focus around the use of a small, mobile force competing against a larger, more unwieldy one. The Guerrilla focuses on organizing in small units, depending on the support of the local population, as well as taking advantage of terrain more accommodating of small units.

Tactically, the guerrilla army would avoid any confrontation with large units of enemy troops, but seek and eliminate small groups of soldiers to minimize losses and exhaust the opposing force. Not limiting their targets to personnel, enemy resources are also preferred targets. All of that is to weaken the enemy's strength, to cause the enemy eventually to be unable to prosecute the war any longer, and to force the enemy to withdraw.

[Azarael]

Attacking is already something we're having trouble motivating people to do. A complete absence of timers will never result in a siege.

[Akalukz]

Attacking is already something we're having trouble motivating people to do. A complete absence of timers will never result in a siege.

The motivation thing, i would hazard to guess that it is because everyone already has BIS gear (on thier mains). T4 merc/anni wipe incoming

[Bozzax]

Well you could consider dropping locks after keeps are taken at least just to mess with the blob.. I'd even consider denying them doors for their newly capped keeps.
(Just to get rid of auto win and lessen x-realm)

[Morf]

I think any talk about existing balancers in the game, such as group cap, is pointless when people can and do complain about the impossibility of winning when your realm is outnumbered. I didn't just wake up one day and decide "Hey, how can I screw with a working system and make it worse?" If you're outnumbered in an engagement where skill is even on both sides, you're going to lose. If we can expect most engagements in a zone to be fought under such conditions, then we have a problem.

I dont understand whats wrong with this, if players are evenly skilled then the only plausible way to win is with numbers, thats how pvp is imo.

What i have seen myself from leading and playing in wb's and i think wb situations is what this patch was more directed at is, it isnt numbers that is the problem, ofc numbers can and alot of the time is the reason why a realm wins or loses but, its players not listening and doing there own thing that costs you the most.
You can beat numbers using strategy and teamwork, it wont be easy but its doable, problem is ppl dont they either lack the leader or they lack the discipline to take note of instructions.
Penalising everyone because most of the players dont use strategy or teamwork sucks, myself after spending around 4 hours the past few days in rvr have seen no change to how rvr was other then less groups roaming and more ppl blobbing.
Without wanting to sound all dramatic and ungrateful i am pretty much done with rvr for the time being in t4 and any time i do spend in game will be on alts or in sc's.

[Marsares]

I think any talk about existing balancers in the game, such as group cap, is pointless when people can and do complain about the impossibility of winning when your realm is outnumbered. I didn't just wake up one day and decide "Hey, how can I screw with a working system and make it worse?" If you're outnumbered in an engagement where skill is even on both sides, you're going to lose. If we can expect most engagements in a zone to be fought under such conditions, then we have a problem.

I dont understand whats wrong with this, if players are evenly skilled then the only plausible way to win is with numbers, thats how pvp is imo.

I'd disagree. Perhaps a case of semantics, but to me "skills" are at an individual level, i.e. how good someone is at playing their character. When the sides are evenly balanced and evenly skilled, what then matters is organisation.

It's called Realm-vs-Realm and 6-mens, WBs and solo roamers should work together as a realm in order to win. Having a zerg lock of sequence of BOs and then zerg a keep does not require organisation, it just requires people to tag along. Instead, there should be an RvR mechanic that requires organisation, whether that is diminishing returns, victory points, resource carriers or whatever. The side that's best at organising themselves to maximise that mechanic should win.

I do agree that both sides aren't well organised and lack realm leaders. That's not surprising. What's there to gain? You lock all zones, you lock RvR for two hours. There's no end-game as such at the moment (i.e. Warlord gear, etc), so people just play for the individual gains and glory, rather than for the realm pride and collective benefits.

That's why it's an Alpha state. The Devs already previously stated they want to (a) create meaningful RvR, (b) enable Forts and (c) enable the end-game - if I'm not mistaken. We're now in phase (a). Personally, I haven't done enough RvR yet to determine if I like the changes, but I'm encouraged by the quick patches that the Devs are churning out to tweak the system and see if it can work. That's agile software development for you.

[georgehabadasher]

Lowering BO timers would go a long way toward splitting up the zerg and is a great change I'm happy to hear about. I think removing BO guards altogether would be beneficial as well. That'd give solo players and small groups (2-3 people) something to do to contribute to the realm and further split up the zerg.

However, as others have pointed out, attacking with even numbers is already very difficult because of the keep lord's power. Reducing BO lock timers exacerbates that problem, so I think nerfing the keep lords a little might compensate.

Regarding crossrealming, people do it because it's the most efficient way to get rewards. We can call them names, but fundamentally, there's nothing wrong with being efficient with your gametime and progression. It's a game design flaw inherited from Mythic that massive zerging is the most efficient way to progress, and that's what we should be addressing. AAO does address it somewhat, but you don't get any rewards if you can't kill anything. Furthermore, the best gear is still tied to zerging (Annihilator and Genesis bags only from keep takes). If this gear were more accessible and everyone got BiS gear at the level they could equip it I think we'd see fewer people crossrealming for easy rewards because they don't need those rewards anymore.

We didn't have crossrealming like this on live, even though the lockout timer was broken for the majority of the time the servers were merged. Why not? Among other things it was because everyone got their Sovereign/Doomflayer/Warpforged well before they could wear them so people just needed renown and emblems. Those are easy enough to get without zerging. NOTE: I'm not saying this is the only factor that prevented crossrealming on live, I'm just saying it's one idea that could reduce it on this server.

[Morf]

Having a zerg lock of sequence of BOs and then zerg a keep does not require organisation, it just requires people to tag along. Instead, there should be an RvR mechanic that requires organisation, whether that is diminishing returns, victory points, resource carriers or whatever. The side that's best at organising themselves to maximise that mechanic should win.

What i meant by this is that the outnumbered side should need to be more organised, its natural that the zerg side gets sloppy and makes mistakes, you have more room for error.
My point was that due to players being unorganised and not willing to think outside the box when it comes to fighting greater numbers ofc you are going to lose.
Im sure you have all seen keep defenses when you are outnumbered and ppl are running around like headless chickens, ppl dying all over the place, no solid plan etc etc this isnt a problem with the rvr mechanics, the campaign or anything its the players fault for being unwilling to either step up and lead or not listening to instructions.

[Akalukz]

Could look into giving some buffs to FULL warband leaders or other AoE buffs or skills on a decent cooldown (speed boost / group bypass / seige immunity / cleanse) to warband members, in a keep raidius etc. that would help encourage open groups / full groups / leaders etc. Set up some minimal requirements etc. Primarily for the underdog side.