Recent changes to Keep lords

[Gerv]

I think, first of all we need to give the changes a chance, people yelling a screaming instantly before the player base has had a chance to figure out how to navigate them or overcome them is a little premature is it not?

It seems that this kind of chance reinforces the need to effectively communicate with warbands and the "elite" guild /alliance groups. Clearly needed to help not only deal efficiently with defenders but also to tank the lord because they are inevitably geared and organized better.

[Dabbart]

I shudder to think how the general reception to Dungeon Bosses is going to be...

I dunno if so many are just used to HP mountains as Lords, whether they have forgotten Live, or just have trouble with problem solving skills... But seriously, go check out some video's of Dungeon bosses or Epic Keep Defenses on Youtube from Live.

The Keep Lord is a powerful Boss monster. They are the Top Dog in that ORvR lake. Hence why they are the Lord of an entire Keep! Not supposed to be like fighting a champ but with higher HP. You are supposed to require general tactics in order to deal with them. And 1 person should have issue tanking it themselves. It's designed to stand up against a full WB+...

Try this, If you are in a PUG WB, BEFORE you drop the inner, find out the "best" 2 tanks in the WB(best as in defensive). Put them both in the same group and have them Cross-Guard each other. Put 2 healers in that group(3 if your worried) inform EVER OTHER TANK that they are NOT to Taunt or Pull the Lord agro.

All your tanks need to pull is face the Lord towards a Wall, and Taunt whenever the Lord gets pulled somewhere else, or the current Tanking person's health gets Low. Use abilities that increase your damage resistance and Bobs your Uncle. Edit: Obviously watch for his AoE attacks(the spinning is a bit of a clue...) and so on and so forth...

If you refuse to plan or organize, then yea. It'll be tough. But it's supposed to be. The "skill" in this game really comes down to organization, planning, and communication. Try to utilize those, and when you are PUGing? If your WB refuses to listen? Just boot them out! Inform people that they get 2 chances to follow Commands and then they will be booted. Don't feel like you have to have a full 24 person WB. 2 full groups(ie enough tanks/healers/DPS) that listen and coordinate will be far superior to 24 randoms that each do whatever they feel like.

Oh, and for the record? Some of the BEST PvP games, the MOST PLAYED PvP games, the highest RATED PvP games, all have PvE elements inside the actual PvP. Exceptionally few games have "pure pvp" w/o any environmental obstacles. Removing all PvE from the PvP of WAR would make this game stupidly Boring. Imo at least.

[Morf]

Its a good thing, means ppl will have to use there brain and not just zerg the keep lord with ease.
The ways to handle a keep lord with or without defenders are there, positioning correctly to not get knocked off, using morales to reduce damage, focusing on enemy players first instead of the keep lord, pulling back to lure enemy players out so you can counter push and wipe them, xguarding, having your dps go easy so not to get aggro, the list goes on, but ofc instead of communicating and being organised (granted in a pug wb this is not easy but given time ppl should understand that you need to use your brain and listen) ppl complain about it being to difficult.....

And to add im pretty sure an organised 6 players could take down a keep lord with no defenders.

[NoRKaLKiLLa]

I'm going to bite my tounge until we try more lords without a massive group of attackers and defenders.

[Theseus]

As I hadnt the time yet to try out the new keeplords and as it didn´t become clear, at least to me, in this discussion, i would like to ask two questions. First, I s there any hint, like a speacial motion, when the keeplord will use an abillity? And second, can keeplords be knocked down like the bosses in Tovl on live?

[Nasharan]

Err, adding "real" bosses like on live without having a working aggro system seems to be a bad idea.

[Nasharan]

Err, adding "real" bosses like on live without having a working aggro system seems to be a bad idea.

See the banner at the top? Its an alpha, you are testers, thanks for your work, keep it up.

So why don't add a working aggro system to the game BEFORE adding bosses to pvp? Or in other words: if the aggro system is somewhat too difficult to add right now, just wait with adding bosses to the keep.

[Nasharan]

Because you dont get to decide what we work on

That is correct. But you want people to give you feedback on the game and game changes and that's exactly what I'm doing. No need to feel offended.

[Genisaurus]

So why don't add a working aggro system to the game BEFORE adding bosses to pvp? Or in other words: if the aggro system is somewhat too difficult to add right now, just wait with adding bosses to the keep.

Because you dont get to decide what we work on

What I'm sure Bizarro Torque would say, is that it's because these are two different problems being worked on by two different people. If Dev A is working on an aggro system, and Dev B is working on lord abilities, it would be frustrating if Dev B had to sit on his hands until Dev A was done. Dev A might have a death in the family, or be changing jobs, or have to work overtime, and just not be able to implement the aggro system Dev B is waiting on. As a result, Dev B has to try to find other things to do in the meantime, that aren't also bottlenecked by the aggro system.

It doesn't seem like that big of a deal when there's only 2 devs in the equation, but there's 8ish. If everyone had to wait for everyone else to finish their projects before working on their own, the project would move at a snails pace with people checking in daily to see if their dependencies were complete yet. It's far easier to just get things done ASAP, even if it hurts for a month or two. It all works out in time.

[Dabbart]

...

Reread what you wrote. Pretend someone else is speaking to you that way. Now how do you imagine you would react?

Torque is actually being pretty nice here imo.. Nasharan, We have no idea what they are working on when where how or why. We have no idea what they are capable of working on, and what they aren't. We know nothing. So yea, provide some feedback. Don't question their intelligence or assume that they are just retarded.

That's what I got from read your stuff anyways...