Premades vs. premades

[Morf]

that. ofc people want to have fun, but if you're doing prem vs prem the goal is to win. gimmick/cheese factors that could potentially affect the gameplay should be removed, imo. But yeah caledor woods works too for 6v6.

I agree but at the same time EC is what it is, you know if you position badly you could pay the price(unless you are a wl ).
Right everyone plays to win but alot of groups play with each other firstly for fun and company not purely to have the best setup and to win, taking the odd death if u get punted over the edge isnt the end of the world and can cause some laughter in ts and such.
If we could have 2 6v6 premade sc's then i dont see the reason to change EC, if u want some serious/e-peen style 6v6 then you dont que for EC you go for caledor woods or whatever the 2nd 6v6 sc is.

[Nameless]

the problem with EC is that it is heavily mdps focused. There is just not enough place to kite add to that the punts from tanks and being rdps/backline healer (archetypes that rely on kitting) is much more harder and punishing.
So making EC only 6v6 and premade only will just limit the oportunities for rdps/backline healers to be taken for premade setups.
Imo the void should be fill with water. So the unusable side of the map will provide some kitting area where everyone is abit slower.
that will be oportunities for so many classes to shine and will add additional depth to the strategies for that sc.
Atm being rdps vs equal skilled opponent hinder your group chance for success.

Not to mention that EC is like only sc where double dok is superior to dok + backline healer (to certain level that is true for double wp also).

Give more equal playground for more classes, that should be the main focus. Otherwise the mdps regime will start from t3...

[DefinitelyNotWingz]

Can we agree that both parties probably want to win EC?
Yes?

If yes and one party lacks a decent kick, how can a scenario ,where you engage every 2min for 15s, be working as intended?

Once we have lvl 35, so kobs and chosen have their kicks, I dont see why EC shouldnt be like it was on live.

[Penril]

Did you guys miss the part where i (and someone else too) mentioned that Caledor Woods (or a different SC) should be the premade-only 6v6 SC? Ok, let me repeat it again:

Khaine's Embrace: Pug-only SC.
Caledor Woods: Premade-only SC
All other SC's remain the way they are (yes that includes EC, don't put a ridiculous invisible wall in it)

Better? If you disagree with this, please don't **** post. Simply give a different suggestion (if you explain your reasoning it would be nice too).

[Vigfuss]

On live there were always pug 6 vs 6 in EC. You could avoid being punted anywhere bad by not being dumb, and the punts usually happened only when one team was baiting the other team into a spot where they could be easily punted. You could even avoid death by superpunts IIRC.

I don't really care one way of the other, but the punt factor provided at least a chance for a creative pug group to win against a decent premade.

[Soulcheg]

I don't think there should be GvG scenario. Solo-que-only - yes.

[Vigfuss]

On live there were always pug 6 vs 6 in EC. You could avoid being punted anywhere bad by not being dumb, and the punts usually happened only when one team was baiting the other team into a spot where they could be easily punted. You could even avoid death by superpunts IIRC.

I don't really care one way of the other, but the punt factor provided at least a chance for a creative pug group to win against a decent premade.

On second thought its sort of crappy for any group lacking a good punt no matter how good they are.

[Soulcheg]

Btw, proper exit from scenarios when? :^)

[Thorondir]

Does Iron Clad also have to be brought back? If no, why bring back EC, it is basically just as broken. Ekrund is only slightly better (looking at you hallways and LOS ramps.)

I know, this is an exaggeration but it is kind of frustrating that there are some scenarios that completely sideline RDPS. Organized group play already leans heavily in favour of the melee train, do we really need cage matches?

I guess ultimately, the solution is, don't run RDPS in a group that ques for these scenarios. I just don't see any scenarios where MDPS is sidelined in the same way so why does it make sense to do this to RDPS? Petition for a new scenario consisting of two sides seperated by a giant chasm, no obstacles.

[Sizer]

Cant believe people think EC would work for premades vs premades. Even with a wall so you cant punt its just a terrible, terrible scen. It would be great for pugs since its so quick it wouldnt matter if you get a scen without healers/dps/ect., but there are better ones for premades.

Caledor woods would be amazing for 6v6, as would bfp (a simplified version of bfp with only 1 flag would work great if thats possible). Or even gates, that could work fine too.