Go for da soft Spot/Relentless Strike

[Jaycub]

A good player using NB is going to limit their potential, A bad player using it will probably make them marginally better.

The problem with NB from what I have seen is it's not 100% reliable, and the conditions you set will never be a catchall and you will find yourself in situations where NB uses something you wish it hadn't or isn't the best thing for that situation.

I have spent hours coming up with rotations and conditionals trying to get a perfect rotation etc... and on every character I have never gotten anything close to what I could do just doing everything manually and reading buffhead etc...

The one thing I do not get, is how anyone can play an MMO without one of these badboys.

Spoiler:

[Razid1987]

The one thing I do not get, is how anyone can play an MMO without one of these badboys.

Spoiler:

That looks suspiciously familiar! *lifts hand from mouse* Oh....

[roadkillrobin]

So what about an addon that makes you don't have to micro manage your pet??? Should that be removed coz it makes the game easier for you? Or a healgrid coz the in game unit frames arn't very good. But thats the way the game was inteneded to be played right?
NB doesn't push any buttons for you, it doesn't move you into oprimal position.
And if we start making exeption for some people for whatever reason then it becomes as massive problem. Using arguments like pride and honor is such an subjetive view on this.
This was big topic back on live aswell and the conclusion devs made there was that NB doesn't play the game for you more then any other addon do.

[Razid1987]

So what about an addon that makes you don't have to micro manage your pet??? Should that be removed coz it makes the game easier for you? Or a healgrid coz the in game unit frames arn't very good. But thats the way the game was inteneded to be played right?
NB doesn't push any buttons for you, it doesn't move you into oprimal position.
And if we start making exeption for some people for whatever reason then it becomes as massive problem. Using arguments like pride and honor is such an subjetive view on this.

Everything in this context is subjective. Your argument is invalid. There's a difference between NB and the addons you mention: Both the base pet UI and Party/WB UI are pure garbage in WAR. By installing these addons you're not giving yourself an advantage, but removing an disadvantage, by not having a handicap. That is not the case with NB, because it effectively play half the game for you, by removing any brain power needed to play the class. I guess it all comes down to your definition of "gaming skill" in some sense. For me, being able to cope with stressful situations, and still make clear and good decisions, all while doing optimal DPS/TPS/HPS is a pretty good indicator. It's all about quick reactions, fast thinking, and in some cases, outsmarting the enemy. NB almost completely removes the thinking part of the equation, in terms of abilities. There's also the whole concept of practice makes perfect. With NB, practice isn't really needed. You just set up the addon, and you're ready to spam 2 or 3 abilities all day long.

This was big topic back on live aswell and the conclusion devs made there was that NB doesn't play the game for you more then any other addon do.

And I happen to disagree with both their conclusion and decision.

[magter3001]

This was big topic back on live aswell and the conclusion devs made there was that NB doesn't play the game for you more then any other addon do.

This is very true.

Let me put it this way. NB is an add-on... and just like other add-ons, it helps you play better. Buffhead or Aura, help you play better by being more aware of what you have on you (like SL or HD). Enemy does the same thing as well as help you see your party better with icons above their heads (you can even mark people). WSCT helps you see the damage you take or deal easier as well as your parries or blocks. Pure helps you see your target easier. etc...

What is an add-on suppose to do then if not help the player?

[Bozzax]

Personally I think /assist has a much bigger negative impact then NB

[Razid1987]

Personally I think /assist has a much bigger impact to the game then NB

Well, true, but I don't see how you're suppose to target 1 guy out of a 150 players standing in a big blob, without such a command. I know I bring up WoW a lot as a comparison, but doing arena there, without frames so you could target the enemy, would be a nightmare. In WoW you can even put enemies on "focus", so you keep them as a secondary target all the time, and can use abilities on them without even targeting them. This is a function that essentially separates the good, from the bad. That's probably not the case with /assist, but I just don't see how you can play battles of such large scales without some kind of tool to help you. It would be very AoE oriented. Even more than it is now, because singling someone out would be too difficult. You could pretty much wave goodbye to setups like the ones that Don't Panic run: Single target melee train, lead by a guarded WE.

[Bozzax]

I don't see how you're suppose to target 1 guy out of a 150 players standing in a big blob, without such a command.

Click on the target? Call target on TS it is called skill

We did fine before the fixed /assist in ROR.

Now all ranged in 6man macro assist with MMO mice that spam assist button (on a 25 ms delay). They don't even have to watch the screen.

This has a much bigger negative impact on the game then NB ever will have.

[roadkillrobin]

So what about an addon that makes you don't have to micro manage your pet??? Should that be removed coz it makes the game easier for you? Or a healgrid coz the in game unit frames arn't very good. But thats the way the game was inteneded to be played right?
NB doesn't push any buttons for you, it doesn't move you into oprimal position.
And if we start making exeption for some people for whatever reason then it becomes as massive problem. Using arguments like pride and honor is such an subjetive view on this.

Everything in this context is subjective. Your argument is invalid. There's a difference between NB and the addons you mention: Both the base pet UI and Party/WB UI are pure garbage in WAR. By installing these addons you're not giving yourself an advantage, but removing an disadvantage, by not having a handicap. That is not the case with NB, because it effectively play half the game for you, by removing any brain power needed to play the class. I guess it all comes down to your definition of "gaming skill" in some sense. For me, being able to cope with stressful situations, and still make clear and good decisions, all while doing optimal DPS/TPS/HPS is a pretty good indicator. It's all about quick reactions, fast thinking, and in some cases, outsmarting the enemy. NB almost completely removes the thinking part of the equation, in terms of abilities. There's also the whole concept of practice makes perfect. With NB, practice isn't really needed. You just set up the addon, and you're ready to spam 2 or 3 abilities all day long.

This was big topic back on live aswell and the conclusion devs made there was that NB doesn't play the game for you more then any other addon do.

And I happen to disagree with both their conclusion and decision.

Well those addons I mentioned also removes and simplefies decisions making for you. Enemy for example displays if someone in your group is healdebuffed while the orginal UI only displays the abillty icon and you need to hover it to see wich one it is. So Enemy removing the hovering part of it. Should Enemy now be considered a not a fair addon to use coz it simplefies your desicion to cleanse or not???? The pet addons almoast complelty removes any micro management of the pets. These pet addons do by far more work in term of playing the game for you then NB does. And using garbage UI and PET AI as an arugemt here just make the arguments that some classes have have clumsy mechanics or abillties and these addons helps out witn that more valid.

[Razid1987]

Well those addons I mentioned also removes and simplefies decisions making for you. Enemy for example displays if someone in your group is healdebuffed while the orginal UI only displays the abillty icon and you need to hover it to see wich one it is. So Enemy removing the hovering part of it. Should Enemy now be considered a not a fair addon to use coz it simplefies your desicion to cleanse or not????

I get what you're saying, but I still don't think it's the same. NB messes with your actionbars. Hovering over a target with a heal debuff, would probably mean that you're a healer. In which case, you'd mouseover that target anyway. So I don't really see the big difference, tbh.

The pet addons almoast complelty removes any micro management of the pets. These pet addons do by far more work in term of playing the game for you then NB does. And using garbage UI and PET AI as an arugemt here just make the arguments that some classes have have clumsy mechanics or abillties and these addons helps out witn that more valid.

Clumsy game with clumsy mechanics. This is why almsot all of my friends don't like WAR and never made it past T2 in live. And yes, that's exactly my point. But altering what abilites go off, with the press of a key, is always gonna feel cheap for me. And I hoenstly don't know what else I can say. I guess we can agree to disagree.