WL pets also follow their targets across the zone. It's just the way there are atm, let Aza fix it, after all it's AlphaXanax wrote:Just to clarify: Do WL *and* SH pet HPs need fixing... Or just WL?Azarael wrote:The pet actually has too much HP right now. It needs fixing.
Otherwise, the pet's ability damage should match live. Don't know about the auto attack, because I had to guess at it. I think the AA is classed as that from a green one-handed weapon of the pet's level.
And is it legit for SH pets to be able to attack through walls and follow Order halfway across the zone -- Or is this something that will be fixed as well?
Thanks.
WLs are the new SHs
- magter3001
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Re: WLs are the new SHs
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- wargrimnir
- Head Game Master
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Re: WLs are the new SHs
I've had my turret shooting through walls in GoE as well. I assume it's the same basic issue.Azarael wrote:Both WL and SH pets need fixing.
SH pets can attack through walls because we can't do LoS checks on them. This will not change any time soon.
Re: WLs are the new SHs
Finally WLs get some well deserved fix to the core of their problem love it!Azarael wrote:Ignoring the fact that the pet has too much HP for now:
It's really not that much work to fix pets.
- Fix stat scaling so that pets scale absolutely with the master - if violating those stupid training buffs and innate "50% of owner stat X" transferrals is necessary to do this, then so be it
- If necessary, reduce AoE damage taken by pets
- Modify the pet cooldown timer
If desto whine to much (as we always do) you can consider
-lower the pets damage when it is on its own chasing. Example scale % with distance from wl/100 so at 50feet from wl 50% damage etc
-range check pet abilities from WL (30-50feet or something) as the WL commands his pet to do XXX
(I'm likely to die countless times as of this fix but I really don't care as it is a long due fix to a previously broken class)
A reasonable RvR system that could make the majority happy http://imgur.com/HL6cgl7
- jonathanmurphy3
- Posts: 266
Re: WLs are the new SHs
Provided the AoE dmg is reduced, that's cool. Pets die too quickly to AOE-spamming marauders.
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Re: WLs are the new SHs
There is one final thing that needs to be dealt with in the context of pets: Their role buffs. I must confess that I would rather this be done sooner than later.
The most obvious examples of why these role buffs are terrible design are the three Training buffs for the WL.
Trained to Threaten is obviously designed to make the pet more tanky, so that the pet can act as a distraction, but there are problems with this approach:
- The pet doesn't have any means of pulling attacks onto itself
- The pet isn't getting any Strength so its attack damage is pathetic
- The pet gets Toughness and Wounds passed from the master, but if the master is meant to be dealing the damage, the master needs to stack Strength and not Toughness
Trained to Hunt's real problem is that it passes 50% of the master's stats to the lion. That's not acceptable scaling.
Trained to Kill's problem is similar to that of TTT, but less pronounced; the master is supposed to pull attacks off the lion (in Mythic's design dreams ), and the lion is meant to be the major player in terms of dealing damage, but no defense is given to the lion, and the master has to stack Str to give the lion any damage to begin with.
My general solution to the problem of pet stats, therefore, is this:
Firstly, a pet should receive most stats from the master's items. I would always pass the following stats:
Willpower, Initiative, Parry, Dodge, Disrupt, Resistances, Armor, AA speed, AA damage, Crit Rate, Crit Damage, Strikethrough
Secondly, in order to preserve the intent of the role buffs in making pets more specialised towards roles, I would propose reworking the stat passing completely. Currently, stats are passed from the master's stat to the pet's stat, which forces the pet to mirror the master's stat layout. My proposal for handling this is as follows:
- Consider the stats that are commonly passed from master to pet: (Str+WS/BS+WS/Int), Toughness and Wounds.
- Find the master's item stat bonus in all of the relevant stats, and accumulate this to make a total.
- Divide this total out to the pet's stats according to some distribution ratios, based on the pet or the training buff in question.
For example, TTK would have a distribution favoring Strength and Weaponskill, and TTT would favour Toughness and Wounds. TTH could be implemented either as balance, or as a direct pass of the master's stats to the pet.
This way, the pet retains its particular specialisation from its Training or summoning buff - but it also scales, absolutely and undeniably, with its master.
The most obvious examples of why these role buffs are terrible design are the three Training buffs for the WL.
Trained to Threaten is obviously designed to make the pet more tanky, so that the pet can act as a distraction, but there are problems with this approach:
- The pet doesn't have any means of pulling attacks onto itself
- The pet isn't getting any Strength so its attack damage is pathetic
- The pet gets Toughness and Wounds passed from the master, but if the master is meant to be dealing the damage, the master needs to stack Strength and not Toughness
Trained to Hunt's real problem is that it passes 50% of the master's stats to the lion. That's not acceptable scaling.
Trained to Kill's problem is similar to that of TTT, but less pronounced; the master is supposed to pull attacks off the lion (in Mythic's design dreams ), and the lion is meant to be the major player in terms of dealing damage, but no defense is given to the lion, and the master has to stack Str to give the lion any damage to begin with.
My general solution to the problem of pet stats, therefore, is this:
Firstly, a pet should receive most stats from the master's items. I would always pass the following stats:
Willpower, Initiative, Parry, Dodge, Disrupt, Resistances, Armor, AA speed, AA damage, Crit Rate, Crit Damage, Strikethrough
Secondly, in order to preserve the intent of the role buffs in making pets more specialised towards roles, I would propose reworking the stat passing completely. Currently, stats are passed from the master's stat to the pet's stat, which forces the pet to mirror the master's stat layout. My proposal for handling this is as follows:
- Consider the stats that are commonly passed from master to pet: (Str+WS/BS+WS/Int), Toughness and Wounds.
- Find the master's item stat bonus in all of the relevant stats, and accumulate this to make a total.
- Divide this total out to the pet's stats according to some distribution ratios, based on the pet or the training buff in question.
For example, TTK would have a distribution favoring Strength and Weaponskill, and TTT would favour Toughness and Wounds. TTH could be implemented either as balance, or as a direct pass of the master's stats to the pet.
This way, the pet retains its particular specialisation from its Training or summoning buff - but it also scales, absolutely and undeniably, with its master.
- wargrimnir
- Head Game Master
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Re: WLs are the new SHs
So your pet receives it's specialized stats based on the total bonus divided among all of your stats. That way with TTT the master would be able to stack str+ws, but the pet would receive wnd+tgh instead.
Something to look into would be how that split scaling would work when over the soft-cap and your bonus is cut in half. It might give WL's a reason to spread their stats evenly to avoid any softcap in favor of having a stronger, possibly overpowered lion.
Something to look into would be how that split scaling would work when over the soft-cap and your bonus is cut in half. It might give WL's a reason to spread their stats evenly to avoid any softcap in favor of having a stronger, possibly overpowered lion.
- Kaitanaroyr
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Re: WLs are the new SHs
Well if they do buff the pet hopefully people start killing it more loner+revenge proc was rare in 6 mans
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Re: WLs are the new SHs
I'd make stats miror WL regardless of TTX. There is a WL secondly effect on all TTX that is differance enough. So burst WL gets a burst kitten and tanky WL get tanky kitten and TTX gives +5 crits, 50 toughness or additional attacksAzarael wrote:There is one final thing that needs to be dealt with in the context of pets: Their role buffs. I must confess that I would rather this be done sooner than later.....
This way, the pet retains its particular specialisation from its Training or summoning buff - but it also scales, absolutely and undeniably, with its master.
A reasonable RvR system that could make the majority happy http://imgur.com/HL6cgl7
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- jonathanmurphy3
- Posts: 266
Re: WLs are the new SHs
That's because a Loner WL doesn't offer anything that a WH/Slayer couldn't provide.Kaitanaroyr wrote:Well if they do buff the pet hopefully people start killing it more loner+revenge proc was rare in 6 mans
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Re: WLs are the new SHs
perma snarejonathanmurphy3 wrote:
That's because a Loner WL doesn't offer anything that a WH/Slayer couldn't provide.
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