wargrimnir wrote: ↑
Tue Jul 21, 2020 11:19 pm
I'm pretty sure it boils down to Fashionhammer swaying class distribution in melee. Destro melee looks cool across the board. Order has a cat-elf and a naked midget to compliment their dress-wearing swordy-elf, codpiece feather-knight, and angry garbage can, with a token bald-man melee healer (facetiously critical here, most order classes look pretty good to me personally). Functionally, Order has plenty of tools to run a successful melee train on paper
. Unfortunately, we can't make them more appealing to play visually. Assets are hard, database isn't. I dunno, no one mentioned it yet, might as well get this theory rolling too.
And thus we go full circle and arrive back at Bombling's order is like it is thread. A lot of people pick classes based on how they look and feel and for the power fantasy. Order has a lot of ranged power fantasies (dude with gun and another gun, Legolas, FIRE WIZARD) while destro has the big hulking melee brute fantasy nailed. At the moment the top-tier content meta favours melee so the side with more popular melee classes will win.
Back before cities (and during the time when city isn't running) those BWs and Engis take a giant dump on most of the melee while sitting 100ft (or way more for Engis) in harder to reach places while the melee stand around not doing much (maybe camp a postern). Hell, today in the Black Crag defense I couldn't even stand on the inner keep walls as the mass of Engineers on the outer walls can reach and snipe everyone so immediately the defenders are pushed inside.
tefnaht wrote: ↑
Wed Jul 22, 2020 9:40 am
Half of dps classes have no place in this close combat aoe spam meta, how they can to organize anything valuable? Reroll? Last 2 armor sets have no analogue in PvE and have no other place to get it. If current statement with afk "no place in wb" classes in some instances is a problem - give other ways for this people to achieve end game gear or make place in wb for them or not blend wb\premade with solo q. And with "no place in wb" bigger for order, not only because class spread in population, but with the count of valuable classes in fraction for that specific setup.
I think, this is not a big problem, all gets theirs progression(just not so "fun"), close combat aoe spam was meta at live and so is here, just more dps classes involved to this, not all, but more. But at live any tokens can be dropped from players(depends on their rr)...
All 6 order and destro DPS classes have a place in city WBs, it's just that for some of those classes you only want 1. A single Engi is often brought along, a single WH (unless doing something very specific it competes with the ASW), 1-2 ASW if running a tight melee train, etc, where-as you can stack up BWs/Slayers/WLs much easier. Hell, some classes like Engi and WH really only have a good place in organised WBs and are kinda a waste in less organised WBs. It seems a lot of players in this thread either don't regularly fight with and/or against good city WBs so don't know what works and what doesn't.
Also, order's main meta for cities at the moment is ST melee train with some cleave support. They do the ST train far better than destro. Throw in some hybrid-spec BWs alternate between AOE pressure and throwing out quick nukes to finish off targets from range and Slayers doing what Slayers do. It works well.