Mist/Napalm

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Orontes
Posts: 198

Re: Mist/Napalm

Post#21 » Tue Jun 23, 2020 6:28 am

Zxul wrote:
Mon Jun 22, 2020 8:24 am

-Napalm/Mist, as well as dmg pots, were nerfed- no more procs, as well as no more crits.
-Engies/maguses complained that after change dmg on Napalm/Mist sucks.
-Devs upped the dmg, without unnerfing the procs part, possibly not all fix is working.
Nothing above contradicts earlier posts. Moreover, and directly to the point: post the change, the Powers were given data showing the new crap damage reality of Mist/Napalm. They recognized crit. needed to be returned and stated it would be, but it hasn't happened. That is the issue.

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Kobra
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Posts: 126

Re: Mist/Napalm

Post#22 » Tue Jun 23, 2020 9:24 pm

Orontes is correct, it was mentioned that crit would be added back in.

First issue - Dissolving Mist/Napalm right now isn't really all that useful because of the lack of crit. When I see a magus running this I die a little inside because it means they are ignoring the WS/BT/BOC/IFC rotation that is so effective at controlling the spread of SW/BW/WL plaguery going on. So as of right now, Mist should be considered a rather ineffective, if not downright useless spec. Just spec up WS/BT/BOC/IFC and then get the Tornado, which DOES crit, and you'll do much better, and be more useful.

Second issue - Summoning pets becomes such a problem that the tactic slow simply must be given up to instant-summon. This is major problem for Magus, but not really an issue for White Lions because their pets have twice the HP/Armor/Resists of the Magus Pet. So yes, I agree here that they should either buff the magus pet HP/Armor/Resists, or remove them from most of the AOE dmg. (but leave WL's with it)

Until such a time the first issue is corrected, run Havoc build, and use the tornado AOE instead, and stop using the useless mist builds.

For the pet, you really must run the insta-summon tactic. But also remember, you can now use/abuse your pet for on the fly CC - blow it up and it gives you an AOE 3 second knockdown. I can't tell you how many times I insta-summon a pet, kill it to KD a WL, then resummon instantly, stack dots on the WL, drop a Daemonic Infestation for another 5 second stun, then finish off the WL before he can actually do much of anything. Also note - adding this rotation to a nerfed button will change your life. Thank me later.

In a large raid/siege, I just keep the pet out of range of the AOE, or just use nerfed buttons to re-summon it along with a normal rotation.

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Przepraszam
Posts: 40

Re: Mist/Napalm

Post#23 » Tue Jun 23, 2020 11:17 pm

Kobra wrote:
Tue Jun 23, 2020 9:24 pm
Orontes is correct, it was mentioned that crit would be added back in.

First issue - Dissolving Mist/Napalm right now isn't really all that useful because of the lack of crit. When I see a magus running this I die a little inside because it means they are ignoring the WS/BT/BOC/IFC rotation that is so effective at controlling the spread of SW/BW/WL plaguery going on. So as of right now, Mist should be considered a rather ineffective, if not downright useless spec. Just spec up WS/BT/BOC/IFC and then get the Tornado, which DOES crit, and you'll do much better, and be more useful.

Second issue - Summoning pets becomes such a problem that the tactic slow simply must be given up to instant-summon. This is major problem for Magus, but not really an issue for White Lions because their pets have twice the HP/Armor/Resists of the Magus Pet. So yes, I agree here that they should either buff the magus pet HP/Armor/Resists, or remove them from most of the AOE dmg. (but leave WL's with it)

Until such a time the first issue is corrected, run Havoc build, and use the tornado AOE instead, and stop using the useless mist builds.

For the pet, you really must run the insta-summon tactic. But also remember, you can now use/abuse your pet for on the fly CC - blow it up and it gives you an AOE 3 second knockdown. I can't tell you how many times I insta-summon a pet, kill it to KD a WL, then resummon instantly, stack dots on the WL, drop a Daemonic Infestation for another 5 second stun, then finish off the WL before he can actually do much of anything. Also note - adding this rotation to a nerfed button will change your life. Thank me later.

In a large raid/siege, I just keep the pet out of range of the AOE, or just use nerfed buttons to re-summon it along with a normal rotation.
Wow i can see You are a very skillfull magus player, and im sure i could learn alot from You
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wargrimnir
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Re: Mist/Napalm

Post#24 » Tue Jun 23, 2020 11:19 pm

Orontes wrote:
Tue Jun 23, 2020 6:28 am
Zxul wrote:
Mon Jun 22, 2020 8:24 am

-Napalm/Mist, as well as dmg pots, were nerfed- no more procs, as well as no more crits.
-Engies/maguses complained that after change dmg on Napalm/Mist sucks.
-Devs upped the dmg, without unnerfing the procs part, possibly not all fix is working.
Nothing above contradicts earlier posts. Moreover, and directly to the point: post the change, the Powers were given data showing the new crap damage reality of Mist/Napalm. They recognized crit. needed to be returned and stated it would be, but it hasn't happened. That is the issue.
Powers here. Hi sweetie. We forgot to add crit back to these, but honestly it hasn't been a big change in their ability to perform, so it might just stay that way. Powers checking out, so long cowboy.
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Orontes
Posts: 198

Re: Mist/Napalm

Post#25 » Wed Jun 24, 2020 12:42 am

wargrimnir wrote:
Tue Jun 23, 2020 11:19 pm
Orontes wrote:
Tue Jun 23, 2020 6:28 am
Zxul wrote:
Mon Jun 22, 2020 8:24 am

-Napalm/Mist, as well as dmg pots, were nerfed- no more procs, as well as no more crits.
-Engies/maguses complained that after change dmg on Napalm/Mist sucks.
-Devs upped the dmg, without unnerfing the procs part, possibly not all fix is working.
Nothing above contradicts earlier posts. Moreover, and directly to the point: post the change, the Powers were given data showing the new crap damage reality of Mist/Napalm. They recognized crit. needed to be returned and stated it would be, but it hasn't happened. That is the issue.
Powers here. Hi sweetie. We forgot to add crit back to these, but honestly it hasn't been a big change in their ability to perform, so it might just stay that way. Powers checking out, so long cowboy.
Sir, Thank you for engaging in this thread.

I must disagree with your new comment above. It directly contradicts your earlier statements. My guess is just as crit. was forgotten to be added back in, it's likely the rationale for its re-inclusion has also been forgotten. This is the general pattern when it comes to things magi/engi. The mess up on magi/engi pets being susceptible to AOE damage on a neft meant for WL's beasts being another example. Why are magi/engi pets so weak? Why is that desirable? It hamstrings the classes, forcing them to use a tactic slot with the instant resummon, and even then it's a grim affair.

To refresh things: from the May 13th Changlog we have the below comment:

As far as testing mist, 700 with hardcapped int and pet buff is what im getting as well. After spirit res, and toughness we can expect a lot less... considering its something you can just walk out of and takes 20 seconds to even ramp up to that point I would hardly call it potent enough to be a 13 pt ability or even as good as it was before with the ability to crit etc...

Your reply was "Some data on this will be nice to see."

The following was provided: https://imgur.com/a/bKBEDwl

This then led to your comment: "Cool, that's right around where it was expected to be. Once we add crits back to it, should be fine."

It makes no sense that a 13pt. ability should be so weak. Doing 300-400 odd pts. per two second tick at the tail end of a 20 second build up that can just be walked around is not acceptable. Please consider and reconnect with your original reaction.

Noh
Posts: 18

Re: Mist/Napalm

Post#26 » Wed Jun 24, 2020 8:25 am


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Crumbs
Posts: 162

Re: Mist/Napalm

Post#27 » Wed Jun 24, 2020 9:15 am

wargrimnir wrote:
Tue Jun 23, 2020 11:19 pm
Orontes wrote:
Tue Jun 23, 2020 6:28 am
Zxul wrote:
Mon Jun 22, 2020 8:24 am

-Napalm/Mist, as well as dmg pots, were nerfed- no more procs, as well as no more crits.
-Engies/maguses complained that after change dmg on Napalm/Mist sucks.
-Devs upped the dmg, without unnerfing the procs part, possibly not all fix is working.
Nothing above contradicts earlier posts. Moreover, and directly to the point: post the change, the Powers were given data showing the new crap damage reality of Mist/Napalm. They recognized crit. needed to be returned and stated it would be, but it hasn't happened. That is the issue.
Powers here. Hi sweetie. We forgot to add crit back to these, but honestly it hasn't been a big change in their ability to perform, so it might just stay that way. Powers checking out, so long cowboy.
might as well leave the crit tactic bugged out too since it doesn't affect me pressing my buttons
Mekanik [engi] 40/85
[magus] 40/70

Omegus
Posts: 477

Re: Mist/Napalm

Post#28 » Wed Jun 24, 2020 11:17 am

wargrimnir wrote:
Tue Jun 23, 2020 11:19 pm
Orontes wrote:
Tue Jun 23, 2020 6:28 am
Zxul wrote:
Mon Jun 22, 2020 8:24 am

-Napalm/Mist, as well as dmg pots, were nerfed- no more procs, as well as no more crits.
-Engies/maguses complained that after change dmg on Napalm/Mist sucks.
-Devs upped the dmg, without unnerfing the procs part, possibly not all fix is working.
Nothing above contradicts earlier posts. Moreover, and directly to the point: post the change, the Powers were given data showing the new crap damage reality of Mist/Napalm. They recognized crit. needed to be returned and stated it would be, but it hasn't happened. That is the issue.
Powers here. Hi sweetie. We forgot to add crit back to these, but honestly it hasn't been a big change in their ability to perform, so it might just stay that way. Powers checking out, so long cowboy.
As much as we all love a good sarcastic Warg post, as per https://github.com/WarEmu/WarBugs/issues/16954 Napalm's crit was actually restored but it wasn't added to Mist, but I'm sure this was picked up in the thorough review of how the abilities are now performing ;). Is the intent for Napalm to work one way and Mists another?
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Orontes
Posts: 198

Re: Mist/Napalm

Post#29 » Wed Jun 24, 2020 12:05 pm


I can confirm, per the referenced damage log, Napalm was fixed and can crit. while Mist remains unable. Mist needs to be brought back to the same normal standard.

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Crumbs
Posts: 162

Re: Mist/Napalm

Post#30 » Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:36 pm

engis napalm still doesnt gain damage bonus from turret mechanic
Mekanik [engi] 40/85
[magus] 40/70

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