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From the first fight we know it's over.

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Elemint
Posts: 258

Re: From the first fight we know it's over.

Post#191 » Tue Jun 16, 2020 1:23 pm

The more effort you spend learning the game / organizing, the higher your winrate goes, the shorter the grind for BiS gear. I really don't see what's the problem with this? If losing gave you nothing, i would agree with this thread, it would be unfair, but the system is so lenient towards losers that you can soloq and afk instances until you're full sovereign.
What i'm really wondering is what magical suggestion you have for whatever you call balance is? Force 2/2/2? Great, 40% dps doesn't get an instance pop, because **** them. Force 24v24? If you are not in que with 24 on destru from the first minute, you're not getting an instance. "Average" MMR of the warband? Order loses most cities, so now 6 wbs get a pop and the rest sits in que because MMR disparity is too big.
Please, let me know of a system more pug friendly than the one right now, which is just based on pure luck.

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Vladthedad
Posts: 29

Re: From the first fight we know it's over.

Post#192 » Tue Jun 16, 2020 1:28 pm

The argument from people who solo queue and put in less "effort" than those in established guilds is bizzare.

I fully promote that the game should be played in a way you find fun, whatever way that is, you should do it. As with all MMOs and to be honest, in life generally, you get what you put in. You can't expect to get the best gear in the game if you don't put even a reasonable bit of effort in, the same way you can't expect to drive a Ferrari IRL if you don't bust your ass and work hard.

The same logic applies here. I fully see where some people are saying they don't have much time to play and when they do, they get stomped. Because of RL requirements I can only really play a few hours a day under the current situation, and that might change when times change. But when I do log in, I make sure that I am learning and becoming the best player I can be to get the best gear. I try and run in organised groups because a) that's more fun for me and b) that's how I learn. When i'm in game I try to get better in the hopes that I'll eventually get the best gear in the game.

If you don't want to do that because that's not fun, then you do you, but don't then complain that you're not driving a ferrari (or have soverign gear).
Barbaphus - Chosen - TUP
Elhelion - White Lion - The Unlikely Plan

M0rw47h
Posts: 898

Re: From the first fight we know it's over.

Post#193 » Tue Jun 16, 2020 1:36 pm

Elemint wrote: Tue Jun 16, 2020 1:23 pm "Average" MMR of the warband? Order loses most cities, so now 6 wbs get a pop and the rest sits in que because MMR disparity is too big.
Please, let me know of a system more pug friendly than the one right now, which is just based on pure luck.
Pretty easy, you can match the highest MMR on destro vs the highest MMR on order, then 2nd best vs 2nd best and so on.
Since, you're not matchmaking instantly after people enter que, but after everyone has signed up it should be easy for matchmaker.

Elemint
Posts: 258

Re: From the first fight we know it's over.

Post#194 » Tue Jun 16, 2020 1:57 pm

M0rw47h wrote: Tue Jun 16, 2020 1:36 pm
Spoiler:
Elemint wrote: Tue Jun 16, 2020 1:23 pm "Average" MMR of the warband? Order loses most cities, so now 6 wbs get a pop and the rest sits in que because MMR disparity is too big.
Please, let me know of a system more pug friendly than the one right now, which is just based on pure luck.
Pretty easy, you can match the highest MMR on destro vs the highest MMR on order, then 2nd best vs 2nd best and so on.
Since, you're not matchmaking instantly after people enter que, but after everyone has signed up it should be easy for matchmaker.
Okay, now the bottom of the zerg realm never gets a pop. But they don't deserve even a chance at BiS, sucks to suck right?

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Detangler
Posts: 986

Re: From the first fight we know it's over.

Post#195 » Tue Jun 16, 2020 2:31 pm

How many instances of stupidly imbalanced destro teams do you see in cities? How many instances of stupidly imbalanced order teams do you see in cities? And people wonder why Destro wins more city fights...

I've pugged probably 75% of my cities by just joining a group from /5 before city starts. its not hard to organize in 10 minutes.

Roll more tanks and healers, dont bring yet another engie and witch hunter to your group.
Detangler and alts - 84 Chosen, other 40s - DoK, Zealot, SH, WE, BG, BO
Destro - Mostly Harmless
Tangler and alts - 8X IB, other 40s - RP, SM
Order - Most dishonorable

M0rw47h
Posts: 898

Re: From the first fight we know it's over.

Post#196 » Tue Jun 16, 2020 2:44 pm

Elemint wrote: Tue Jun 16, 2020 1:57 pm Okay, now the bottom of the zerg realm never gets a pop. But they don't deserve even a chance at BiS, sucks to suck right?
It's already player choice to be on overpopulated realm. It's also their choice to be at bottom of food chain.
Quality of life for those who actualy play game intended way (read: group up with other people) is kinda more important in my eyes than those who walk path of least resistance.

Not to mention, you can already aquire royal crests from zone locks, even in blue bag, but I guess path of least resistance people rarely get even blue bags. Indeed, they don't deserve BiS gear.

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Haskr
Posts: 532

Re: From the first fight we know it's over.

Post#197 » Tue Jun 16, 2020 3:08 pm

desizt wrote: Tue Jun 16, 2020 12:05 pm Did city last night vs Order pug with 1 tank, 4 healers and 19 dps?

Sure it's so easy to just run to the gate and queue up and ignore 50+ people spamming LFG in /5 not even bothering to make a 6/12 man optimized group.

And then "FrOm tHe fiRsT fiGhT wE kNoW iT's ovEr." threads.

/sigh

Edit:
Please just put premades vs premades. You detect a 5+ group queing, keep them queing until same group on other side. Its so boring if not...
If you want "solo cities" you are playing a wrong game.
hmmm, that could have been my instance, was knacks the dps am in it?

I think you people see it all wrong, people need to embrace the Pug spirit even more, i que for city always solo, and its great fun, i listen to music and put on a series on second monitor to watch while playing, the hour always flys by real fast and you get always rewards, last city i got 6 emblems from loosing and than a golden bag and a white one, so i got 13 emblems total :D, and from the two forts before i got also 8, sadly none from stwonewatch :cry: :cry:

and the great thing is devs cant change it, because if you give no rewards for loosing people just wouldnt que anymore on order :mrgreen:
I really love the system as it is right now, I was in pnp and cntk guild back in the day as tank and it was both times **** very boring snoozefest experience, now with dps am i just log in and type .tellblock (then people cant whisper you 'rez me rez me' or 'heal heal help help zomg') and then you can have fun right now and dont need to make a group.
for me now i only have pity for elite guilds who have to ask guildmaster to take a piss for 2 minutes :D
so solution for me is very easy: just que solo for city, it works really good and you might also loose if you make 222 warband if you go against premade guild, so just go solo from beginning and listen to music or podcast while playing, its really chill :shock: :shock: it will always work because devs cant change the system now, then nobody would que anymore if he get nothing from it :mrgreen:

godspeed :D !

Elemint
Posts: 258

Re: From the first fight we know it's over.

Post#198 » Tue Jun 16, 2020 3:15 pm

M0rw47h wrote: Tue Jun 16, 2020 2:44 pm It's already player choice to be on overpopulated realm. It's also their choice to be at bottom of food chain.
Quality of life for those who actualy play game intended way (read: group up with other people) is kinda more important in my eyes than those who walk path of least resistance.

Not to mention, you can already aquire royal crests from zone locks, even in blue bag, but I guess path of least resistance people rarely get even blue bags. Indeed, they don't deserve BiS gear.
And i thought i was cruel...
Riddle me this: Since the evil premades have only pugstomping in mind, what's stopping them from throwing the stage 3 every second city, so they remain in the most populated MMR level?

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M0rw47h
Posts: 898

Re: From the first fight we know it's over.

Post#199 » Tue Jun 16, 2020 3:20 pm

Elemint wrote: Tue Jun 16, 2020 3:15 pm
M0rw47h wrote: Tue Jun 16, 2020 2:44 pm It's already player choice to be on overpopulated realm. It's also their choice to be at bottom of food chain.
Quality of life for those who actualy play game intended way (read: group up with other people) is kinda more important in my eyes than those who walk path of least resistance.

Not to mention, you can already aquire royal crests from zone locks, even in blue bag, but I guess path of least resistance people rarely get even blue bags. Indeed, they don't deserve BiS gear.
And i thought i was cruel...
Riddle me this: Since the evil premades have only pugstomping in mind, what's stopping them from throwing the stage 3 every second city, so they remain in the most populated MMR level?
Thats not issue, if each stage would affect MMR.
Also, pugstomping would give less rewards, with rewards being tied to MMR.

Elemint
Posts: 258

Re: From the first fight we know it's over.

Post#200 » Tue Jun 16, 2020 3:26 pm

M0rw47h wrote: Tue Jun 16, 2020 3:20 pm Thats not issue, if each stage would affect MMR.
Also, pugstomping would give less rewards, with rewards being tied to MMR.
Say you've got a side that has all the premade wbs stacked on it - so, for example order has 5 2000+ MMR WBs, and destru's highest is 1800. Since your proposal has matchmaker pair from the top to bottom, nearly the entire realm of destruction would have low chance of winning, and another 3 threads of the unfairness of it all per week get made.

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