[Theorycrafting] Toughness is broken (or useless) for DoTs

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Ysaran
Posts: 560

Re: [Theorycrafting] Toughness is broken (or useless) for DoTs

Post#71 » Mon Oct 21, 2019 11:05 am

Can we have Bleed 'em Out to scale with strength again?

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WExWH
Posts: 90

Re: [Theorycrafting] Toughness is broken (or useless) for DoTs

Post#72 » Mon Oct 21, 2019 11:38 am

Ysaran wrote:
Mon Oct 21, 2019 11:05 am
Can we have Bleed 'em Out to scale with strength again?
u should create a ticket on bugtracker>bleed 'em Out don't ignore toughness ;)
hogun wrote:
Sat Oct 19, 2019 2:39 pm
thanks to groumf and minipuce for this discovery and thanks to the reactivity of the dev
it's not new(sorry, it's not a discovery) and was reported on bugtracker/discord ror a while ago but is better to talk about it on forum to have a fix :mrgreen:

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Ysaran
Posts: 560

Re: [Theorycrafting] Toughness is broken (or useless) for DoTs

Post#73 » Mon Oct 21, 2019 11:48 am

WExWH wrote:
Mon Oct 21, 2019 11:38 am
u should create a ticket on bugtracker>bleed 'em Out don't ignore toughness ;)
That's not the point. Bleed 'Em Out was scaling with Strength until some time ago (3 or 4 month) but Dev took away the strength contribution from the damage calculation since the ability inflicted too much damage. Since Bleed 'em Out is a DoT and now DoT are mitigated correctly then now damage should receive strength contribution. It's not a bug, it's a balance issue

Zxul
Posts: 427

Re: [Theorycrafting] Toughness is broken (or useless) for DoTs

Post#74 » Mon Oct 21, 2019 4:06 pm

Ysaran wrote:
Mon Oct 21, 2019 11:48 am
WExWH wrote:
Mon Oct 21, 2019 11:38 am
u should create a ticket on bugtracker>bleed 'em Out don't ignore toughness ;)
That's not the point. Bleed 'Em Out was scaling with Strength until some time ago (3 or 4 month) but Dev took away the strength contribution from the damage calculation since the ability inflicted too much damage. Since Bleed 'em Out is a DoT and now DoT are mitigated correctly then now damage should receive strength contribution. It's not a bug, it's a balance issue
If it does't scales with strength, it isn't mitigated by toughness (unless there is a bug).
"Can we play with him, master? He seems so unhappy. Let us help him smile. Please? Or at least let us carve one on his face when he stops screaming."

— Azeila, Alluress of Slaanesh

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Ysaran
Posts: 560

Re: [Theorycrafting] Toughness is broken (or useless) for DoTs

Post#75 » Mon Oct 21, 2019 6:03 pm

I will make some test. but as far as I know toughness is applied to the base damage and it should "mitigate" the off-stat, but if there is no off-stat to mitigate it is simply substracted to the base damage.


this is against the dummy
Image

and this is against a naked mara, with no mutation and 137 toughness
Image

so clearly thougness is applied even if there is no contribution from offensive stat (as it should be). so bleed em out now should receive strenght contribution, this ability is been nerfed too many time

Zxul
Posts: 427

Re: [Theorycrafting] Toughness is broken (or useless) for DoTs

Post#76 » Mon Oct 21, 2019 6:54 pm

Ysaran wrote:
Mon Oct 21, 2019 6:03 pm
I will make some test. but as far as I know toughness is applied to the base damage and it should "mitigate" the off-stat, but if there is no off-stat to mitigate it is simply substracted to the base damage.
In general, if ability doesn't scales with offensive stat, toughness mitigation isn't applied- which is why 900+ toughness tanks mitigate procs for much less then regular abilities.

If that mara didn't had any armor on, then guess bleed em out might be specifically bugged. Possibly something made in process of making it not scale with strength- say something specific was changed on ability, instead of putting it into same category as procs?
"Can we play with him, master? He seems so unhappy. Let us help him smile. Please? Or at least let us carve one on his face when he stops screaming."

— Azeila, Alluress of Slaanesh

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Ysaran
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Re: [Theorycrafting] Toughness is broken (or useless) for DoTs

Post#77 » Mon Oct 21, 2019 7:22 pm

Zxul wrote:
Mon Oct 21, 2019 6:54 pm
Ysaran wrote:
Mon Oct 21, 2019 6:03 pm
I will make some test. but as far as I know toughness is applied to the base damage and it should "mitigate" the off-stat, but if there is no off-stat to mitigate it is simply substracted to the base damage.
In general, if ability doesn't scales with offensive stat, toughness mitigation isn't applied- which is why 900+ toughness tanks mitigate procs for much less then regular abilities.
You are wrong. Toughness is always applied, no matter what.

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Ysaran
Posts: 560

Re: [Theorycrafting] Toughness is broken (or useless) for DoTs

Post#78 » Mon Oct 21, 2019 7:22 pm

Double post
Last edited by Ysaran on Mon Oct 21, 2019 7:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Ysaran
Posts: 560

Re: [Theorycrafting] Toughness is broken (or useless) for DoTs

Post#79 » Mon Oct 21, 2019 7:23 pm

Triple post, sorry. Stupid smartphone

Zxul
Posts: 427

Re: [Theorycrafting] Toughness is broken (or useless) for DoTs

Post#80 » Mon Oct 21, 2019 9:58 pm

Ysaran wrote:
Mon Oct 21, 2019 7:22 pm
Zxul wrote:
Mon Oct 21, 2019 6:54 pm
Ysaran wrote:
Mon Oct 21, 2019 6:03 pm
I will make some test. but as far as I know toughness is applied to the base damage and it should "mitigate" the off-stat, but if there is no off-stat to mitigate it is simply substracted to the base damage.
In general, if ability doesn't scales with offensive stat, toughness mitigation isn't applied- which is why 900+ toughness tanks mitigate procs for much less then regular abilities.
You are wrong. Toughness is always applied, no matter what.
Lol go test it.
"Can we play with him, master? He seems so unhappy. Let us help him smile. Please? Or at least let us carve one on his face when he stops screaming."

— Azeila, Alluress of Slaanesh

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