sc pug is it a trap for noob player ?

[bloodi]

You are aware that city sieges will be scenarios on steroids, yes? A pug only city siege will be impossible to enforce, if not only because of the size of the population.

Hence this discussion is relevant longterm, as it will invetiably flare up again once we'll see the cities again.

Yeah but he has a point, devs stated multiple times that unlike live, scs here are just a minigame that they already put too many resources into and the "true game" is orvr.

Dont be surprised if we dont see city sieges scenarios removed entirely and the fortresses put back in.

[Rodek]

You have to take the forts to get to the city though.

[Darosh]

You are aware that city sieges will be scenarios on steroids, yes? A pug only city siege will be impossible to enforce, if not only because of the size of the population.

Hence this discussion is relevant longterm, as it will invetiably flare up again once we'll see the cities again.

Yeah but he has a point, devs stated multiple times that unlike live, scs here are just a minigame that they already put too many resources into and the "true game" is orvr.

Dont be surprised if we dont see city sieges scenarios removed entirely and the fortresses put back in.

I am aware of dev statements, and I wouldn't be surprised if city sieges were never to be seen again due to the backlash they'd generate.
However, what'll make or break the above is the sentiment that is being cultivated. If the pug SC never saw the light of the day, people would be far less inclined to try and ducttape the concept over, onto city sieges to begin with ~ it is a self-fullfilling prophecy.

I'd personally opt for city sieges AND fortresses rather than just fortresses, as the latter is just an extension of the umbrella that has already been partially erected; masking a bigger problem.

[Telen]

You might aswell toss the pugs an invite to a group (or direct them towards one, or a guild), and help them figure out how to get the most out of their character and playtime.
A group offers more than min-max (which barely anyone <really> commits to), assist, guard, heal, yadayada ~ namely advice (e.g.: mechanics, gear, strats, changes, yadayada) and constructive criticism, last but not least certainly more entertainment (e.g.: [voice] chat) than the dice roll powered pug SC...

I'd, in any case, suggest we do not lock the people (and the various problems) away, into instanced free-for-alls.

Now, before anyone alledges that I want other to play 'like I want them to play' - it doesn't hurt trying it out, does it? If you don't fancy it, well, you don't fancy it ~ best case scenario: you find interest in it and folks to play with, worst case scenario: you get back to into the pug dreadmill.

Btw, wtf is that analogy even - I mean I get your point, but thats some odd imagery, alth'.

I played nightly in my guild on live for years. I imagine many of the puggers did. Had some great alliance wb nights and if those guys were here I probably would. I always felt the obligation of not letting the side down though so played totally differently to how I do here. In a pug wb youre free to play what you want how you want. Even though I know my old guild wouldnt have cared. I would.

[Darosh]

In a pug wb youre free to be play how you want.

You can do that just fine in any group, provided you group with people that aren't hardcore epeen-acrobats - it comes down to one's agency, finding and sticking to a fun group and leaving a group that produces nothing but salt are two sides of the same coin.

[Fallenkezef]

In a pug wb youre free to be play how you want.

You can do that just fine in any group, provided you group with people that aren't hardcore epeen-acrobats - it comes down to one's agency, finding and sticking to a fun group and leaving a group that produces nothing but salt are two sides of the same coin.

Ive had some of my most enjoyable experiences in totaly random pugs, everyone thrown in and doing thier best.

One pug SC is fine, personaly I'd have all three T1 SC's as pugs and the rest as premade. Dont see the issue with keeping both camps happy.

Also if pugs pop more often than premade it suggests pug is more popular with premades as a minority. Which does say allot right there.

[Toadwart]

Moaning about premade sc's is old too...pug sc should be pug (random) duo queing takes this randomness away alot.

so a duo queuing should come up against premades, just to appease the solo players. gotcha

Maybe you dont realize solo players currently come up against pre mades right now, as in all the time right now.

I only solo queue, very rarely am I not against a pre made.

So, yeah, duo players can go against premades. Leave the pug scenario's to solo only.

[peterthepan3]

Moaning about premade sc's is old too...pug sc should be pug (random) duo queing takes this randomness away alot.

so a duo queuing should come up against premades, just to appease the solo players. gotcha

Maybe you dont realize solo players currently come up against pre mades right now, as in all the time right now.

I only solo queue, very rarely am I not against a pre made.

So, yeah, duo players can go against premades. Leave the pug scenario's to solo only.

A duo isn't a premade, mate, no matter how many times you try to swing it that way.

Quit with this self-deprecating act, it's rather boring now. Fix up, get good, play with other people, stop using mickey mouse comps and demanding **** to be changed to make up for your own failings, and only then shall Valhalla be presented to you. (Not targeted at you btw, just a general musing).

[Fallenkezef]

so a duo queuing should come up against premades, just to appease the solo players. gotcha

Maybe you dont realize solo players currently come up against pre mades right now, as in all the time right now.

I only solo queue, very rarely am I not against a pre made.

So, yeah, duo players can go against premades. Leave the pug scenario's to solo only.

A duo isn't a premade, mate, no matter how many times you try to swing it that way.

Quit with this self-deprecating act, it's rather boring now. Fix up, get good, play with other people, stop using mickey mouse comps and demanding **** to be changed to make up for your own failings, and only then shall Valhalla be presented to you. (Not targeted at you btw, just a general musing).

Peter, you remind me of my neighbour, he's a Jehovah's Witness. He's a nice bloke, friendly, helpful, a really good neighbour but fundamentaly intolerant and firmly believes if everyone believed the way he does, the world will be perfect.

Thing is, it's a false reality. People will pug, will try unconventional specs and play purely for lols and, damn it all, this server needs such people as much as it needs the hardcore players and everyone inbetween.

[Darosh]

Spoiler:

Maybe you dont realize solo players currently come up against pre mades right now, as in all the time right now.

I only solo queue, very rarely am I not against a pre made.

So, yeah, duo players can go against premades. Leave the pug scenario's to solo only.

A duo isn't a premade, mate, no matter how many times you try to swing it that way.

Quit with this self-deprecating act, it's rather boring now. Fix up, get good, play with other people, stop using mickey mouse comps and demanding **** to be changed to make up for your own failings, and only then shall Valhalla be presented to you. (Not targeted at you btw, just a general musing).

Peter, you remind me of my neighbour, he's a Jehovah's Witness. He's a nice bloke, friendly, helpful, a really good neighbour but fundamentaly intolerant and firmly believes if everyone believed the way he does, the world will be perfect.

Thing is, it's a false reality. People will pug, will try unconventional specs and play purely for lols and, damn it all, this server needs such people as much as it needs the hardcore players and everyone inbetween.

Issue being:
Players that engage in groupplay do engage others (read: players) in an attempt to change things up - pugs try to crowbar in changes by virtue of threads like these, and the sea of balance/SC/matchmaking related threads (read: outrage).