Population

[Jaycub]

I think tons of amazing cosmetic sets are a terrible idea. *wink wink* Do your worst!

Spoiler:

[Elemint]

Gear grind in combination with zergfest ORvR is the reason i stopped playing.

[th3gatekeeper]

Get the Player back into RoR with the Idea of "log in, get on and make PvP for Fun with equal chances for the moment youre logged in for everybody".
The days of mmorpgs where you have to grind items for beeing able to "rock" are over, People dont want this, they want to log in and Play! Easy come - Easy go - not a item grind forever. Or what you think how many of the current Players are there in a year to have the Conquerer Set grinded? Only the Nerds. The other give up.

I think this is where MANY people are in the game. Ive tried to say this many times, but this game started being developed in what? 2002? 2004? I think it released in like 2006? I cant remember, but the POINT is, what people wanted in games back then is VERY different today. The "gaming" scene has changed entirely. The "problem" I see, is the target demographic that people usually make is too focused.

Look. There are broadly FOUR types of play-sessions and PLAYERS can actually enjoy all FOUR of these at different times.

1) "soft touch" play sessions
2) "hard touch" play sessions
3) short play sessions
4) long play sessions

Each game needs to offer SOMETHING in these camps, or they will not retain and DEFINITELY not grow in population.

People are most familiar with "hard touch" systems and this game is largely built around this. What hard touch means is that in order to really accomplish ANYTHING in this game, it relies on you teaming with other players.

Soft touch, would be something where interaction with others is OPTIONAL.

short play sessions I would quantify in maybe 15-30 minutes. Where if I cannot get on an reasonable expect to accomplish my "goal" in that time frame, I wont even log in at all.

long play sessions can be 2+ hours.


Now, ROR is GREAT when it comes to "hard touch" and LONG play systems since the entire game is built around this. But it completely and utterly SUCKS when it comes to #1 and #3 - "soft touch" and short play sessions.

This IMO is where we are losing players and why we are not growing.

The implementation of the PUG SC, was GREAT for this. However this PUG can rotate to a BAD map (what we just experienced the last several weeks which meant that late night SCs were D-E-A-D!) But SCs have been "declared" by the DEVs as just a "minigame" and this has NOT helped...

In my humble opinion, I would love to see not just the PUG SC get some "love" but also the PREMADE SCs get some love.

First, I think it a PHENOMENAL idea to offer TWO PUG SCs instead of 1.
Then, I would also give incentive for the premade SCs to offer say 10 emblems per win (instead of 6). This may bring back the "premade teams".

I know this would also be work, and for whatever reason its seen as "whining" and "wanting gear quicker" but I still am a HUGE advocate for an Emblem:Medallion vendor... I dont know how feasible this is... but it would enable players to play how they want, to eventually earn the gear they want.

Another thing this game could benefit from is making currency bound to account (not character - again not sure if possible) so that if your group needs a healer, you pick up a healer and the progress helps towards your "main".

Then things like RVR would be primarily cosmetic stuff AND/OR Lateral gear progress. People like doing things MERELY for the "stigma" attached to an item. If anything is hard to get, and flashy (noticeable at a glance) people want it. They want to be "that guy" running around the IC on a special mount, or with a special helm or cape, etc...

So what I would look at doing is maybe releasing higher "tier" gear, but diminish the stats down to the level of Domi/Conq so its not "mandatory power creep". Same stat allocation, same armor #s, etc. Just more CHOICE and also appearance!

But THIS is the direction I would personally love to see.

So the SHORT play sessions and the SOFT TOUCH systems are fulfilled by the PUG SCs (two)
Hard Touch focus encouraged in SCs (via Premade maps offering more emblems per win)

Then RVR is the "hard touch" + long play session.

So now we have something for every TYPE of play session.

What I feel like gets often unfairly categorized is that people who do the PUG SC are PUGS. Which ISNT TRUE. Some of the best, most "harcore" players in the game like doing the PUG SC because its A) FUN B) Not so "try hard" and C) if population is low they may NOT be able to get a group.

Sometimes people just want to log in, and not have to "try hard" and just HAVE FUN. The PUG SC allows for this.
When people DO wnat to "try hard" encourage this with more emblems in the premade ONLY maps.
If people want to "try hard" for a LONG TIME - they can go do RVR.

Those are my thoughts on ROR and what would be good QOL improvements to support population and maybe even grow it.

[peterthepan3]

Your intentions are well-meaning, but an additional pug scenario in rotation would 100% put the nail in the coffin for group pops. 10 emblems won't get groups queuing because noone wants to 'go to all the trouble of making a group' and wait for longer pops with harder pvp for a few extra emblems; as sad as it sounds it is the truth, evident in today's group vs group pops (or lack thereof).

[Darosh]

The sad thing about all of this is:
If this game were to completly cater to pugs, it would just fall apart - not slowly fade away as is the case momentarily - as the entire game design revolves around groups (e.g.: toolkits, gear, RvR - by default, RvR without emphasis on organized groupplay dissolves into literally nothing but roflstomps, with the side with the most players ALWAYS coming out on top, with little to nothing to gain for the underdogs [see: GW2, ESO, ...], ...).

The fate of this project population-wise completly depends on community development and efforts.
Right now the conflict - read: outright animosity - between pugs and organized players is readily apparent.
Before that is not being dealt with, I personally do not see any change from the Dev's side to have a positive impact whatsoever.

Abbd.: I.e.: You want to have ONE community, not two seemingly seperate ones 'making their own thing' - playing with another > playing along side each other.

Abbd.:

What I feel like gets often unfairly categorized is that people who do the PUG SC are PUGS. Which ISNT TRUE. Some of the best, most "harcore" players in the game like doing the PUG SC because its A) FUN B) Not so "try hard" and C) if population is low they may NOT be able to get a group.

That is correct, yet there is a difference between non-pugs pugging and actual pugs pugging. I have yet to see someone that sports a 6man or participates in organized ORvR to bitch and moan in /sc or otherwise put his epeen and "hardcoreness" on display, whereas the most hardcore of pugs are consistently giving their teammates ****. (Note: We touched on that in the DPS DoK thread in regards to exotic specs and such.)
The same applies to encounters with organized opposition, not once have I seen someone that sports a 6man or participates in organized ORvR to ever bitch and moan about it, whereas the most hardcore of pugs love to give premades **** - some so dedicated that they have fancy oneliners at the ready at all times to dish out whenever they manage to kill their supposed archnemesis.
More importantly even, I have yet to spot someone that sports a 6man or participates in organized ORvR to ever care about k/d in scenarios the way the most hardcore of pugs do ~ i.e.: sit at spawn for the entirety of the scenario because they cannot cope with dying in a videogame.

I wouldn't consider SCs, be it normal SCs or PUG SCs, to be a pleasent experience if the chat is riddled with complaints, or the spawn is camped by everyone and their mother, waiting for an opportunity to roflstomp or cash in emblems effortlessly either way.
So to say that most pugs - that do nothing but pug - would be there to have some "quick fun" is a stretch in 7/10 cases, imho.

[th3gatekeeper]

Your intentions are well-meaning, but an additional pug scenario in rotation would 100% put the nail in the coffin for group pops. 10 emblems won't get groups queuing because noone wants to 'go to all the trouble of making a group' and wait for longer pops with harder pvp for a few extra emblems; as sad as it sounds it is the truth, evident in today's group vs group pops (or lack thereof).

Well what do you suggest then....

[Carso]

Low....ain't it...

Wonder why?

Gone Fishing!

[footpatrol2]

Remove solo queing for sc's completely. The mindset this creates is toxic. Tie sc's back to the campaign. Only allow full groups of 6 to que. This will encourage player's to try to form a group and gets player's communicating with each other which is a good thing.

Soloer's / lonewolf's have ORvR.

[peterthepan3]

Remove solo queing for sc's completely. The mindset this creates is toxic. Tie sc's back to the campaign. Only allow full groups of 6 to que. This will encourage player's to try to form a group and gets player's communicating with each other which is a good thing.

Soloer's / lonewolf's have ORvR.

<3

@thegatekeeper: just greatly reduce the rewards from the pug scenario and greatly increase the rewards of other scenarios/group scenarios. Get people utilising the /5, going on comms (or not), playing together. Communal aspect of MMO. Strengthen ties. Stop catering to solo players. I know dudes who will come on for 3 hours a week and still ensure they find at least a few people to play with. I know NA is different, but I still see more than enough people ungrouped in scenarios that could - if they wanted - group up.

[Toonman]

Remove solo queing for sc's completely. The mindset this creates is toxic. Tie sc's back to the campaign. Only allow full groups of 6 to que. This will encourage player's to try to form a group and gets player's communicating with each other which is a good thing.

Soloer's / lonewolf's have ORvR.

No, it won't encourage anything at all. People will stop playing or leave before they have to form groups to que for a sc. WAR catered to everyone, no reason RoR can't do the same. Also, sc tied to the WAR campaign was awful and created more toxicity than anything on RoR has ever done, that's not even debatable.