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[SW] ASW with Shadow Sting in Ranked SC

Swordmaster, Shadow Warrior, White Lion, Archmage

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Bosli
Posts: 25

[SW] ASW with Shadow Sting in Ranked SC

Post#1 » Fri Jan 10, 2020 6:33 pm

First off, my experiences derive only from ranked solo, I barely play any open or standard scenarios.
As it stands, I don't see any fun in playing destro healer Ranked when there's a somewhat decent ASW in the ranked matches, since there is simply nothing a healer can do to save the focused target because Shadow Sting is way too strong.

The two destro healers that could cleanse it are DoK and Shaman, they both have 5 seconds cooldown and cleanse the prerequisite ailment first, if not also other debuffs from tanks or the second DPS. Even if they somehow manage to take it off, he can just reapply it, on mid-range, without a cooldown, AND can do so while in Assault stance. A target that is permanently stuck with the 50% heal debuff will very likely die even if he stays in guard range all the time, and you can watch him continuously lose health until he's dead even if both healers focus on him. Zealot stagger also usually doesn't work either, since he is right in the middle of the fray and stays there. It's simply not fun to be completely powerless against them as a healer.

In contrast to that, the mSH has WAY less single target DPS as well as burst capabilities, and cannot use his mirrored Rotten Arrer while in Squig Armor. Deactivating the armor every time he wants to apply a heal debuff makes him an easy target to kill in few seconds, so that's not really an option. If the second DPS doesn't bring a healdebuff either, the SHs additional lack of single target burst most of the time makes killing just a gamble of hopefully hitting the CCs at the right time to throw the enemy team off balance and barely kill someone.

Yes, everybody is crying about mSH being so extremely strong, but he is not in ranked, especially not compared to ASW. And now that we are getting actual ranked matches, these should also be thought of regarding balancing, at least if we want to see all classes in the "higher tiers".

Giving the mSH the heal debuff would be too crazy, because then he really has almost everything one would need. But at least the ASW should also have to switch stances to apply his heal debuff, so that he has to show some actual skill and stance-dancing to carry a match with simple PUGs-assistme.


Hoping for actual feedback and discussion, no "stop destroying my class" posts.

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Secrets
Developer
Posts: 162

Re: [SW] ASW with Shadow Sting in Ranked SC

Post#2 » Fri Jan 10, 2020 6:54 pm

uh

DoK would like to have a word with you

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Manatikik
Posts: 905

Re: [SW] ASW with Shadow Sting in Ranked SC

Post#3 » Fri Jan 10, 2020 6:57 pm

Firistly, mSH is arguable stronger than ASW in ranked due to a variety of factors that can negatively impact healers more than SS can (though if you only play Destro it can be hard to see this point). Also Destro has an AoE 100% uptime 50% Inc HD via the DPS DoK so trying to say it’s unfun in those matchups you can only imagine how bad it is for Order.

It’s hard to balance it out without killing off the class for a variety of reasons: the lack of a CD is due to a) SW being a primarily support DPS class where your priority is to be debuffing and b) due to how Initiative calculates Dodge at a different rate than other defenses due to the amount of initiative and ctbc reduction in conjunction with Dodge/Disrupt being the easiest thing in the world to stack you get Dodged way more than you can get parried; it’s fairly easy to stop SS from being applied (the first time it does get increasingly more difficult the longer you’re in a target) because 90% of the SW’s 90% of the time will layer it with BHA first to get it going so just strip that and you prevent the SS; and the reasons it is not Stance restricted is because it is one of the iconic (read only reason to bring a SW to a party) along with Eye Shot that defines a SW purpose AND devs have made changes to SW to move away from Stance Dancing into a more linear playstyle that makes Stance Camping more optimal.

So yea there’s a lot of reasons to keep it like it is and not really any good reasons (in the current server climate) to change besides ‘whine’.
<Montague><Capulet>

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Ekundu01
Posts: 175

Re: [SW] ASW with Shadow Sting in Ranked SC

Post#4 » Fri Jan 10, 2020 7:03 pm

Secrets wrote:
Fri Jan 10, 2020 6:54 pm
uh

DoK would like to have a word with you

Image
Are you saying that the dot tics should be applying heal debuff on crit dot tics? Because the zealot tactic that does the same thing only applies on direct crit hits and not dot tics.
Trismack

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larsulu
Posts: 400

Re: [SW] ASW with Shadow Sting in Ranked SC

Post#5 » Fri Jan 10, 2020 7:06 pm

Asw and sh melee are both broken.
Easy to play with high burst/mobility.
decimo marauder
larsulu zealot
norsemanherra wp
stormurfru dok

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Manatikik
Posts: 905

Re: [SW] ASW with Shadow Sting in Ranked SC

Post#6 » Fri Jan 10, 2020 7:12 pm

Ekundu01 wrote:
Fri Jan 10, 2020 7:03 pm
Secrets wrote:
Fri Jan 10, 2020 6:54 pm
uh

DoK would like to have a word with you

Image
Are you saying that the dot tics should be applying heal debuff on crit dot tics? Because the zealot tactic that does the same thing only applies on direct crit hits and not dot tics.

Fell Sacrifice triggers Curse of Khaine on DoT Crist yes but not every skill is supposed to work the same way or we’d still have -220 init debuff SW etc etc
<Montague><Capulet>

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Bozzax
Posts: 2045

Re: [SW] ASW with Shadow Sting in Ranked SC

Post#7 » Fri Jan 10, 2020 8:05 pm

Bs it is a dot

DD (AA, dd abilites, very few effects with duration) proc .... dots dont (Dok DE or Slayer ID do)

220 ini debuff was retarded so drop it bc of the exponential gain and being order only
A reasonable RvR system that could make the majority happy http://imgur.com/HL6cgl7

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SkPrime
Posts: 51

Re: [SW] ASW with Shadow Sting in Ranked SC

Post#8 » Sat Jan 11, 2020 12:40 am

larsulu wrote:
Fri Jan 10, 2020 7:06 pm
Asw and sh melee are both broken.
Easy to play with high burst/mobility.
I wouldn't call aSW "easy" to play. The assault rotation is maybe simple but the class need a good switching between skirmish and Assault to perform. Knowledge on interrupt, stance-timing, kiting...
Ok the burst damage is high but the class is not mindless overall.
Skprime <Tilean Warlords> Shadow Warrior :?

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wpc56
Posts: 81

Re: [SW] ASW with Shadow Sting in Ranked SC

Post#9 » Sat Jan 11, 2020 2:43 am

When you want to play with hard mode, switch to order and see how order healers can possibly put up with a class/Dok that can apply healing debuff on MULTIPLE people in one instant cast.

Keldo
Posts: 20

Re: [SW] ASW with Shadow Sting in Ranked SC

Post#10 » Mon Jan 13, 2020 11:36 am

Plus, you only have a look at the aSW and he falls over.
Really SW is your definition of a glass Canon.
He has a Lil. More burst than mSH but way way way less survival.
Just focus as a Destro team and SW dies in 2 seconds

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