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[SW] General Guide

Swordmaster, Shadow Warrior, White Lion, Archmage

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dansari
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Re: [SW] General Guide

Post#61 » Mon Apr 02, 2018 5:16 pm

Fair point. Thanks
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michela89
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Re: [SW] General Guide

Post#62 » Mon Apr 02, 2018 6:34 pm

I dunno about never using DB at all, I can understand that if you are trying to burst a guy in a couple of CDs let's say in a train assist it's probably not needed.
But there is no need for a mathematical genius to say that on a 9 sec window it should be a dps boost.

but then again with the double ini debuff, if GrimSlash is chain critting like a mofo there's probably no need for it...no idea.

It sure sucks for me if it's not needed, I think Draw Blood is a cool skill I've always liked to use.

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Manatikik
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Re: [SW] General Guide

Post#63 » Mon Apr 02, 2018 6:42 pm

michela89 wrote:
Mon Apr 02, 2018 6:34 pm
I dunno about never using DB at all, I can understand that if you are going to quick burst then it's probably not needed.
But there is no need for a mathematical genius to say that on a 9 sec window it should be a dps boost.

Depends what situation you're talking about. If it's a 1v1 vs a WE sure but then your banking on living 9 seconds and just outlasting when in reality your best bet is to front load your burst and burst faster. In a sc or small scal your only window of true DPS is while your target is separated from their guard in which case again you want to front load your burst. Not to mention the point of Assault is to preload your rotation from afar then get in to burst and get back out, not to stay in the middle of things like a tank or a Mara.


In a perfect world where a target isn't getting healed or guarded and you aren't in a DPS race against them then yes DB has a spot in a rotation. But if you find yourself in those situations all the time you're probably not playing against very good players and most things you do would work.
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michela89
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Re: [SW] General Guide

Post#64 » Mon Apr 02, 2018 6:45 pm

Manatikik wrote:
Mon Apr 02, 2018 6:42 pm
Depends what situation you're talking about. If it's a 1v1 vs a WE sure but then your banking on living 9 seconds and just outlasting when in reality your best bet is to front load your burst and burst faster. In a sc or small scal your only window of true DPS is while your target is separated from their guard in which case again you want to front load your burst. Not to mention the point of Assault is to preload your rotation from afar then get in to burst and get back out, not to stay in the middle of things like a tank or a Mara.

In a perfect world where a target isn't getting healed or guarded and you aren't in a DPS race against them then yes DB has a spot in a rotation. But if you find yourself in those situations all the time you're probably not playing against very good players and most things you do would work.

well then if the window of true dps is when u punt the Guard, considering that it is not something that happens randomly and might be easy called since you are talking premade, having a Draw Blood already on the target when you know a punt is coming seems like the best situation


but yes it's bit sad, considering it takes 3 seconds for the first tick and 6 seconds for the second. Must be the new Merciless Soldier and it's 50% crit dmg on grim slash that makes it not much worth.

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Manatikik
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Re: [SW] General Guide

Post#65 » Mon Apr 02, 2018 7:02 pm

michela89 wrote:
Mon Apr 02, 2018 6:45 pm
Manatikik wrote:
Mon Apr 02, 2018 6:42 pm
Depends what situation you're talking about. If it's a 1v1 vs a WE sure but then your banking on living 9 seconds and just outlasting when in reality your best bet is to front load your burst and burst faster. In a sc or small scal your only window of true DPS is while your target is separated from their guard in which case again you want to front load your burst. Not to mention the point of Assault is to preload your rotation from afar then get in to burst and get back out, not to stay in the middle of things like a tank or a Mara.

In a perfect world where a target isn't getting healed or guarded and you aren't in a DPS race against them then yes DB has a spot in a rotation. But if you find yourself in those situations all the time you're probably not playing against very good players and most things you do would work.

well then if the window of true dps is when u punt the Guard, considering that it is not something that happens randomly and might be easy called since you are talking premade, having a Draw Blood already on the target when you know a punt is coming seems like the best situation


but yes it's bit sad, considering it takes 3 seconds for the first tick and 6 seconds for the second. Must be the new Merciless Soldier and it's 50% crit dmg on grim slash that makes it not much worth.


Yea the changes are great for Assault SW but make some older skills and strats obsolete. Which is fine and progress is good. We as players just have to adapt and move forward
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dansari
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Re: [SW] General Guide

Post#66 » Mon Apr 02, 2018 8:05 pm

Ah yeah I forgot the late tick on DB.
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Mystriss
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Re: [SW] General Guide

Post#67 » Mon Apr 02, 2018 11:16 pm

peterthepan3 wrote:
Mon Apr 02, 2018 1:11 pm
I dunno why you're taking so much personal offence from people giving cookie cutter builds that are designed to promote/facilitate to optimal play, and in regards to the pug comments? Noone is being condescending; rather, people are just saying that in such environments, any spec can work because the skill calibre is (usually) pretty low. The specs being discussed, i.e. those that you would call cookie-cutter, are designed to fend off against competent groups: such specs for SW are limited to (probably) 2 - heavy assault, or skirm.

If you wanna run a full int-spec'd SW, noone is stopping you.
It's true, I am taking things a bit personal and I have good reasons for that. I could explain exactly why and I think everyone would at least understand where I am coming from, but frankly this thread isn't about me, ya know?

The bottom line here is that my opinions, advice, and guidance is always going to be more pug centrist; an ideology and play style that's clearly looked down on as "inferior" in this particular guide/thread.

I've done my best to disassociate with this guide/thread in an impartial manner, but it seems I failed so my apologies for that.
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Fey
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Re: [SW] General Guide

Post#68 » Mon Apr 02, 2018 11:53 pm

DoTs seem to be in a bad state in general, and there is no weaker dot than draw blood/cut ya. I used to use Cut Ya on live simply because I liked the animation.
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Allorien
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Re: [SW] General Guide

Post#69 » Sat Apr 21, 2018 12:57 am

Interesting guide. Thank you for putting in the time and effort to make it, and for people to come here, read, comment, and/or contribute to the thread/server from doing so.

I can't quite understand lack of viable mastery paths. Changes were made to this class for some unknown reasons. I have beef with some changes to mastery paths because it does limit viable play-styles. I am trying to split my points between Paths of Scout/Skirmisher. How on earth can I get a viable build that way? It comes down to Eye Shot being made a special ability for the Path of the Skirmisher, and the order in which they appear in the said Mastery tech tree.

Example:
I used to put points in Path of the Scout up to Fell of the Weak, and select No Quarter, and Fell of the Weak. I would then put my remaining points into Path of the Skirmisher. I would select Shadow Sting, Powerful Draw, and Barrage.

What does the SW bring to the table in a fight? Number one is its spamable incoming 50% heal debuff. Other contributions were to slot Leading Shots (and sacrifice another tactic slotted), a range knockdown/snare, and an amror debuff (which is not worth using compared to other classes armor debuffs and considering it's debuff value is dependent upon how much one put mastery points into the Path of the Scout).

I'm really open to discussion and am wanting to understand the goals behind changes.

I make this post to state that I feel people should be able to spec how they want into the three mastery trees and have comparable damage/dbs/contribution to group/utility etc. A balance. Live servers towards the end, got a bit closer to a balance (though Path of Assault probably needed a bit more to it). My beef on live was that one always had to spec into the Path of the Skirmisher to get Shadow Sting (similar to how Leading Shots used to be a tactic that was only accessed via Path of the Scout). I feel standard utility/contributions to group should be core abilities. And mastery paths should be for emphasis on how damage is delivered (playstyle).

Roughly my background: I was a solid SW on live, and did run with mostly elitist guildmates/alliances. I learned from playing a ton myself, and figuring out what worked and what didn't. I also ask higher rr/better geared/and players who seemed ahead in this quest of being the best SW, questions when I could. Then once recruited into an extremely competitive guild/alliance, I started to learn why it took SO LONG for my guildmates to invite me to groups or even recognize me as a member/speak to me....because having a SW in group meant losing whatever other 'real' dps class that would be there in my stead (and because they hadn't played with a SW that made it work for them - their guild leader tried and completely ditched the class hence another reason for their bias). Some did this in nicer ways, and started to explain what other classes abilities were/did and brought to a group verses what a SW could (because I play ONLY a SW since launch at that time). I stopped playing about a month or two after the RvR expansion ~RR83. Prdps was getting a bit more frustrating with defensive sets and overall increased armor ratings/values without a counter balance in increased armor penetration for prdps and some mdps classes. I came back towards the end of live. I prefer pre-RvR expansion RvR. I wish we could have both new and old City Raids with Warlord PQs and king instances. Was hoping for total revert to old school WAR but I'll take what I can get.

dansari
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Re: [SW] General Guide

Post#70 » Sat Apr 21, 2018 3:35 am

I didn't really play live so I can't necessarily relate but SW is in a good place. Skirmish is strong, assault is meta, and Scout needs a bit of work but overall the class is pretty solid. The class isn't considered "good" for warbands, but it's great in groups. I'm not going to address the eye shot change you mentioned so my advice would simply be to give Assault a try.
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