[KOTBS] Vigilance Requiring Shield

[sharpblader]

I had posted my thoughts elsewhere but wanted to bring it to the Empire forum.

Such an amazing explanation post for Chosen abilities but when it comes to the changes to the knight? Cause Chosen mirror and " a great weapon cannot be used for such a powerful defensive ability". Why? Have we forgotten that unlike Oppression, Vigilance causes knights to do 25% less damage for the entire duration were taking 50% less damage? Once again 2h knight receives nerf because of changes made to Chosen.

Now on a more serious note here are a couple of issues with Knights requiring shield for Vigilance:

1. A huge blow to lower RR 2H knights who will be forced to run SnB. Unless they choose to become a glass cannon immune to de-taunts and in the process become extremely gimped to carry out their basic class function (Guard).

2. The tactic Laurel of Victory will become obsolete. No SnB Knight will waste a tactic slot to maintain damage during vigilance especially without Mighty Soul tactic (removed). A wet noodle removing the 25% damage penalty will still be a wet noodle.

I hate to be snarky with people who put so much time and effort in creating something so amazing but my emotions get the better of me when I see my favourite class getting butchered patch after patch. For that I am sorry.

[Atrosity]

RIP vigilance for 2H knights in PvE :'(

An auto detaunt removal is useless when you are still the lowest damaging tank in the game. Who is detaunting you other than random AoE detaunts that they didn't care if it applied to you or not.

The changes just further nerfed 2H knights...

Runefang baseline at this point makes the most sense, it's already been lowered to 160 stats on Toughness and WS anyways. Why is it in the tree where the main ability is dealing elemental on the DoT ticks?

[kmark101]

Who used vigilance as 2h anyway... stop being nonsense, if you went up that high in mid tree with 2h you either trolled your realm mates or was really stupid or very very low level and clueless - or all of the above.

[Fenris78]

The main issue being there are too many defensive skills and tactics that are tied to shield, as opposite to the Chosen wich got much more freedom.

For reminder the KotBS :
- Parry increase = specced tactic, wich require shield and only buff +15% parry
- Disrupt increase = +15% passive baseline tactic, require shield.
- Crit reduction = none
- Damage reduction = -50% with 10s Vigilance, wich is now tied to a shield.

For chosen :
- Parry = +25% with baseline skill, wich have 15s buff with 10s cd - no requirement other than hitting a target, +25% with 13 pts tactic (requires block), wich can stack together...
- Disrupt = +25% with a 13 pts right tree skill - no requirement other than speccing into it.
- Crit reduction = -10% with baseline tactic, now -10% for party with new tactic
- Damage reduction = 15% with 13pts specced skill, require parry or block (not tied to shield)

How is that even remotely balanced ?
How comes a 2H chosen can deal significantly higher damage (higher base damage + less renown to invest into def specs), while being as much tanky or more than a Knight ?

Chosen can play tanky 2H without almost any restriction, while KotBS have to use a shield for ANY defensive buff, while not having access to matching abilities/tactics.
(And buffs for chosen are almost double bonuses for no reason).

Something need to be done, for example removing shield requirement for some KotBS skills/tactics, or leaving the 2H spec in a miserable state since not being able to either deal meaningful damage nor being remotely tanky is a shame, and will lock one only viable build wich is the boring SnB spec... sad.

[sharpblader]

Who used vigilance as 2h anyway... stop being nonsense, if you went up that high in mid tree with 2h you either trolled your realm mates or was really stupid or very very low level and clueless - or all of the above.

Yes we are being nonsense and are obviously trolling, stupid, low level and clueless for not using the cookie cutter FM, OS, ST and BD as 2h.

If you don't have any constructive argument please type a standard "lol you suck l2p" to sate your trolling needs and leave.

I'm looking for arguments why Vigilance should only be usable with shield and if Laurel's of Victory should be reworked.

Fenris puts forth a valid point that knight has no defensive ability outside of shield anymore. Are there any SnB tanks using Laurel's of Victory? If not can we have a rework?

[Fey]

Did anyone actually use Laurel's of Victory? Cause it looks like garbage. Vigilance is your, "oh ****," button and during those 10 seconds you're trying to survive. If you're using such a potent defensive ability before you execute your dps rotation; well then there should be a trade off.

My knight is only 40/50, but it feels pretty solid from someone who has played all the tanks to 40/50. Left tree is designed for 2-hand, middle for SnB. That falls in line with the rest of the tanks.

If this rather minor (imo) change is so onerous to players who main knight I'm predicting a historic gnashing of teeth when the aura changes come.

[sharpblader]

If this rather minor (imo) change is so onerous to players who main knight I'm predicting a historic gnashing of teeth when the aura changes come.

I would personally love the aura changes because Knights will have their class identity back. Hopefully similar to live's "Aura Shift" prompting a more skill based gameplay.

Coming back to the topic it would seem that the developers are thinking similarly:

Vigilance shield change is likely being reverted soon. Oppression may stick, but we'll discuss further. There's some good arguments in this thread against Vigilance requiring a shield.

[Starx]

Who used vigilance as 2h anyway... stop being nonsense, if you went up that high in mid tree with 2h you either trolled your realm mates or was really stupid or very very low level and clueless - or all of the above.

Why nerf it then? :^)

[Xergon]

Only ppl who were using Vigilance as 2h Knight were those 2h solo pepega wanna be dps, because if u spec into Vigilance u dont bring FocusMending to the group, and if u dont do that when u play Knight in group, u doing something wrong.

Vigilance is extremely powerful ability and as someone already stated, its been used as "Oh ****" button to escape from danger. I play 2h Knight sometimes myself, and i never had need to use Vigilance, just play properly and smart so u never need to use it.

[forsa]

Actually Vigil was used by high lvl 2h utility in cities and wb.
There is enough points to take Vigil, knock FM and OS.
RoR.builders - Knight of the Blazing Sun
2h kn isn't about dmg (at least in RoR), its about applying +10 crit, better punt and ability to survive diving in zerg.
All other tanks have something to increase their survivability 2h, excluding kn (now)