IB Question

[Earthcake]

Is it still good? Yea.
Is IB better than BG in WB play? Yea.

Could you tell us why please ?
Cause to me IB is the worst tank in the game, small scale, wb, sc, whatever (still my favourite character to play cuz i'm as grumpy as him but...).
You don't have time to cast many abilities, and when you do cast them, they are weaker than other's most of the time.

[abezverkhiy]

Cause to me IB is the worst tank in the game, small scale, wb, sc, whatever (still my favourite character to play cuz i'm as grumpy as him but...).
You don't have time to cast many abilities, and when you do cast them, they are weaker than other's most of the time.

I would not dare saying IB is worst tank because of Grudge Unleashed for instance - with its help IB performs HTL! better than any other tank. And HTL! is one of the abilities that defines tank during sieges.

Next, amount of control abilities IB has is just bloody insane.

To me it is the best Order tank and I do not give two shits about auras and blade enchants as long as Destro cannot pass me.

[Earthcake]

Even if ORvR HtL would matter alot, cause no, it doesn't since 90% of sieges are won due to numbers, then BG can do the same, and much more.
And about control, BG also got better control.

Cannot pass you ? Only in 3+ stars keeps, and even there, they can displace you and then ignore you.

[Rapzel]

Is it still good? Yea.
Is IB better than BG in WB play? Yea.

Could you tell us why please ?
Cause to me IB is the worst tank in the game, small scale, wb, sc, whatever (still my favourite character to play cuz i'm as grumpy as him but...).
You don't have time to cast many abilities, and when you do cast them, they are weaker than other's most of the time.

Why?
Small scale because of buffs and debuffs like armour debuff, which only WL has access to otherwise (WL isn't good paired with a slayer), crit buff that "stacks" with KotBS/ASW debuff. 25% parry on target and self, only WS buff in the game which is huge for all of the order melees. All the "innate" debuffs you spam out help cover other curses naturally in your rotation, crit debuff is really strong.
Ofc you can't compare it to kotbs or BG but they're the two best tanks in the game for 6vs6.
BO and SM only brings ungabunga to 6vs6, chosen sure has some nice synergy with certain careers but in no way do they have as strong buffs/debuffs as the IB.
The biggest issue with IB and its very prominent in e.g. solo ranked is that it has zero synergy with SM, which is a tank combo never played in 6vs6.
IB KotBS X2 slayer RP + WP is still the strongest setup you can get.

BG has zero synergy with anything in WB. Only reason you would ever use it is to push fort or to being a 2h for the single target group and have it probably guard a mara or something that can take some damage. As a SnB BG you bring a aoe slow and a lot of block, that's it.

IB had obvious weaknesses and still do in their tank path but the new tactic in brotherhood makes it a great support tank for AP heavy groups, and can buff a DPS to do amazing numbers, adding 25% parry and are + crit to a slayer is also really nice with the benefit of giving him 30 AP each time you use it, then being able to swap around and get the root break and AoE slow isn't bad either.

But ofc its lack-luster it's a balanced career in a game where all other careers are redoncolously OP in their preferred environment.

[detrap]

Is it still good? Yea.
Is IB better than BG in WB play? Yea.

Could you tell us why please ?
Cause to me IB is the worst tank in the game, small scale, wb, sc, whatever (still my favourite character to play cuz i'm as grumpy as him but...).
You don't have time to cast many abilities, and when you do cast them, they are weaker than other's most of the time.

Why?
Small scale because of buffs and debuffs like armour debuff, which only WL has access to otherwise (WL isn't good paired with a slayer), crit buff that "stacks" with KotBS/ASW debuff. 25% parry on target and self, only WS buff in the game which is huge for all of the order melees. All the "innate" debuffs you spam out help cover other curses naturally in your rotation, crit debuff is really strong.
Ofc you can't compare it to kotbs or BG but they're the two best tanks in the game for 6vs6.
BO and SM only brings ungabunga to 6vs6, chosen sure has some nice synergy with certain careers but in no way do they have as strong buffs/debuffs as the IB.
The biggest issue with IB and its very prominent in e.g. solo ranked is that it has zero synergy with SM, which is a tank combo never played in 6vs6.
IB KotBS X2 slayer RP + WP is still the strongest setup you can get.

BG has zero synergy with anything in WB. Only reason you would ever use it is to push fort or to being a 2h for the single target group and have it probably guard a mara or something that can take some damage. As a SnB BG you bring a aoe slow and a lot of block, that's it.

IB had obvious weaknesses and still do in their tank path but the new tactic in brotherhood makes it a great support tank for AP heavy groups, and can buff a DPS to do amazing numbers, adding 25% parry and are + crit to a slayer is also really nice with the benefit of giving him 30 AP each time you use it, then being able to swap around and get the root break and AoE slow isn't bad either.

But ofc its lack-luster it's a balanced career in a game where all other careers are redoncolously OP in their preferred environment.

You have to be joking, BG has similar abilities to that of the knight with a wounds and crit debuff and defense debuff. Perfect for warband play.

IB tank tree is strong and makes them the best snb tank for eating guard damage. Perfect for guarding a slayer.

[CountTalabecland]

Even if ORvR HtL would matter alot, cause no, it doesn't since 90% of sieges are won due to numbers, then BG can do the same, and much more.
And about control, BG also got better control.

Cannot pass you ? Only in 3+ stars keeps, and even there, they can displace you and then ignore you.

As much as I love Grudge Unleashed, it just usually doesn't matter as AP regen just isn't that hard for tanks with the right support + pots. Even then, most keep/fort pushes are over within the time it takes HTL to burn a full bar of AP.

On top of that, IB was a lot more fun before GTDC and SH pounce+360 AOE Knockback and so on. Every class on Order is pretty easy to ping pong all over the place these days with the broken amount of CC destro has.

[Earthcake]

Is it still good? Yea.
Is IB better than BG in WB play? Yea.

Could you tell us why please ?
Cause to me IB is the worst tank in the game, small scale, wb, sc, whatever (still my favourite character to play cuz i'm as grumpy as him but...).
You don't have time to cast many abilities, and when you do cast them, they are weaker than other's most of the time.

Why?
Small scale because of buffs and debuffs like armour debuff, which only WL has access to otherwise (WL isn't good paired with a slayer), crit buff that "stacks" with KotBS/ASW debuff. 25% parry on target and self, only WS buff in the game which is huge for all of the order melees. All the "innate" debuffs you spam out help cover other curses naturally in your rotation, crit debuff is really strong.
Ofc you can't compare it to kotbs or BG but they're the two best tanks in the game for 6vs6.
BO and SM only brings ungabunga to 6vs6, chosen sure has some nice synergy with certain careers but in no way do they have as strong buffs/debuffs as the IB.
The biggest issue with IB and its very prominent in e.g. solo ranked is that it has zero synergy with SM, which is a tank combo never played in 6vs6.
IB KotBS X2 slayer RP + WP is still the strongest setup you can get.

BG has zero synergy with anything in WB. Only reason you would ever use it is to push fort or to being a 2h for the single target group and have it probably guard a mara or something that can take some damage. As a SnB BG you bring a aoe slow and a lot of block, that's it.

IB had obvious weaknesses and still do in their tank path but the new tactic in brotherhood makes it a great support tank for AP heavy groups, and can buff a DPS to do amazing numbers, adding 25% parry and are + crit to a slayer is also really nice with the benefit of giving him 30 AP each time you use it, then being able to swap around and get the root break and AoE slow isn't bad either.

But ofc its lack-luster it's a balanced career in a game where all other careers are redoncolously OP in their preferred environment.

Yeah, if you list all abilities without considering you need 1.15sec to cast any of them, then IB are marvelous, they got almost everything !

Sadly, there is a GCD in this game, and you simply don t have the time to use everything which is why passive buffs or longer durations buff/debuffs are much better than IB ones.
To add insult to injury, if we are talking about AP advantage, KotBS aura is better than TYS! (taking into account a realistic rotation, ofc you can burst output alot more but then you lose many things like challenge and such) when 5 or more enemies are caught in the effect, which is VERY often the case; aura also function when the knight is disabled, TYS! doesn't.

So what you think is balanced, in a nonGCD game, is actually bad in RoR due to that GCD.

[Rapzel]

Could you tell us why please ?
Cause to me IB is the worst tank in the game, small scale, wb, sc, whatever (still my favourite character to play cuz i'm as grumpy as him but...).
You don't have time to cast many abilities, and when you do cast them, they are weaker than other's most of the time.

Why?
Small scale because of buffs and debuffs like armour debuff, which only WL has access to otherwise (WL isn't good paired with a slayer), crit buff that "stacks" with KotBS/ASW debuff. 25% parry on target and self, only WS buff in the game which is huge for all of the order melees. All the "innate" debuffs you spam out help cover other curses naturally in your rotation, crit debuff is really strong.
Ofc you can't compare it to kotbs or BG but they're the two best tanks in the game for 6vs6.
BO and SM only brings ungabunga to 6vs6, chosen sure has some nice synergy with certain careers but in no way do they have as strong buffs/debuffs as the IB.
The biggest issue with IB and its very prominent in e.g. solo ranked is that it has zero synergy with SM, which is a tank combo never played in 6vs6.
IB KotBS X2 slayer RP + WP is still the strongest setup you can get.

BG has zero synergy with anything in WB. Only reason you would ever use it is to push fort or to being a 2h for the single target group and have it probably guard a mara or something that can take some damage. As a SnB BG you bring a aoe slow and a lot of block, that's it.

IB had obvious weaknesses and still do in their tank path but the new tactic in brotherhood makes it a great support tank for AP heavy groups, and can buff a DPS to do amazing numbers, adding 25% parry and are + crit to a slayer is also really nice with the benefit of giving him 30 AP each time you use it, then being able to swap around and get the root break and AoE slow isn't bad either.

But ofc its lack-luster it's a balanced career in a game where all other careers are redoncolously OP in their preferred environment.

Yeah, if you list all abilities without considering you need 1.15sec to cast any of them, then IB are marvelous, they got almost everything !

Sadly, there is a GCD in this game, and you simply don t have the time to use everything which is why passive buffs or longer durations buff/debuffs are much better than IB ones.
To add insult to injury, if we are talking about AP advantage, KotBS aura is better than TYS! (taking into account a realistic rotation, ofc you can burst output alot more but then you lose many things like challenge and such) when 5 or more enemies are caught in the effect, which is VERY often the case; aura also function when the knight is disabled, TYS! doesn't.

So what you think is balanced, in a nonGCD game, is actually bad in RoR due to that GCD.

1.15 gcd to cast any buffs? There's 4 10 sec buffs where 1 is situational and 1 has 20 sec cd. The other 3 buffs are 20 sec long. If you can't weave that Idk what to tell you, 3 buffs are 4.5 sec gcd in the 10 sec you have more than enough time to get some damage and punt as well. Then you add str/WP buff which can be replaced by str crit given you oath a melee, guarded attack should just be avoided as it's a terrible spell, corp buff is situational (I don't think it's ever worth it just to get the AA procc I'd rather use something else in that gcd but it's great against mSH, WE and certain 1vs1).

4 tactics for each career, 3 auras per knight, AP tactic is fine to help out your teammates and combined with other spells your knight may be able to go for a more useful aura than the AP one.
I have zero issues keeping up the prio 1 buffs on any target even if people spam strip on it. It may be impossible to keep all buffs up, but that's not necessary either as you have a team to support you and there's also buffs that are utterly useless such as guarded attack.
There's not a single one lower than 10 sec and a large amount of them are 20.

[Rapzel]

Could you tell us why please ?
Cause to me IB is the worst tank in the game, small scale, wb, sc, whatever (still my favourite character to play cuz i'm as grumpy as him but...).
You don't have time to cast many abilities, and when you do cast them, they are weaker than other's most of the time.

Why?
Small scale because of buffs and debuffs like armour debuff, which only WL has access to otherwise (WL isn't good paired with a slayer), crit buff that "stacks" with KotBS/ASW debuff. 25% parry on target and self, only WS buff in the game which is huge for all of the order melees. All the "innate" debuffs you spam out help cover other curses naturally in your rotation, crit debuff is really strong.
Ofc you can't compare it to kotbs or BG but they're the two best tanks in the game for 6vs6.
BO and SM only brings ungabunga to 6vs6, chosen sure has some nice synergy with certain careers but in no way do they have as strong buffs/debuffs as the IB.
The biggest issue with IB and its very prominent in e.g. solo ranked is that it has zero synergy with SM, which is a tank combo never played in 6vs6.
IB KotBS X2 slayer RP + WP is still the strongest setup you can get.

BG has zero synergy with anything in WB. Only reason you would ever use it is to push fort or to being a 2h for the single target group and have it probably guard a mara or something that can take some damage. As a SnB BG you bring a aoe slow and a lot of block, that's it.

IB had obvious weaknesses and still do in their tank path but the new tactic in brotherhood makes it a great support tank for AP heavy groups, and can buff a DPS to do amazing numbers, adding 25% parry and are + crit to a slayer is also really nice with the benefit of giving him 30 AP each time you use it, then being able to swap around and get the root break and AoE slow isn't bad either.

But ofc its lack-luster it's a balanced career in a game where all other careers are redoncolously OP in their preferred environment.

You have to be joking, BG has similar abilities to that of the knight with a wounds and crit debuff and defense debuff. Perfect for warband play.

IB tank tree is strong and makes them the best snb tank for eating guard damage. Perfect for guarding a slayer.

2h tank, used for ST group, do I need to repeat myself more? Crimson Death has a requirement of wielding a 2H to be used. And yes sure a lot of the base abilities are the same on KotBS and BG, though KotBS also has a working SnB spec and auras added to it. While BG is a damage sponge. Imagine how good KotBS would be in a WB if you removed auras? Thats BG with SnB.

[Drozen]

IB is perfectly fine, i could argue it's the strongest tank alongside the right dps. Like Rapzel mention the combo of IB + SL is in a league on there own (Both wb play and single group play)

Granted there is 10buffs, but not really a issue to rotate them on your outhfriend (or even swap outhfriend and buff other party members with 'em if needed), this is just something that takes time to learn and gett right so keep at it. It's a awsome and strong class to play, you shouldnt feel gimped in any way shape or form when playing IB.

One class shouldnt have everything, wich is good... But what IB do bring is a very strong tank both offensive and defensive in WB's or single party's.

(have not read all post prior to this, but yea.. IB is perfectly fine)