Fun Twist - Healing DoK: Build (comments welcome)

[lefze]

Any updates to this experiment? I was just considering trying something very similar

(http://www.ror.builders/career/disciple ... ,4979,5002)

because, honestly, I tried the usual cookie-cutter backline heal spec and it felt terrible. Constantly running out of Essence was the main issue.

Slot Fueled actions and use Essence lash on cd. What makes DoK feel competitive at all for me is positioning in a way that I get hit by abilities now and then to restore essence but can still back away from morales.

As for the build itself, you would gimp your group by running Empowered transfer over Bloodthirst. And honsestly, if you are good enough to play the class properly and take advantage of Fueled actions the whole playstyle suggested here becomes nothing more than a hazzle. If you party is in real danger the heals from TE won't keep em up in warband play, and if you have the time to use it your party don't actually need the miniscule heal it provides.

Edit: Actually clicked your build to check, good on you for using Fueled actions already. Just one thing to point out is that Terrifying aura won't work with a chalice, are you actually playing dual wield and melee-healing?

Correct. The idea is to face tank with AoE detaunt, regaining Essence when hit (Fueled Actions), and healing with skills from the left tree. Think cookie-cutter backline heal Dok.

You are not meant to heal with TE/Empowered Transfer. But it can be better than Lash sometimes. Say you got punted and only have one target in range. You can spam TE on that target until you have enough essence to continue casting as usual.

I haven't tried this yet I admit; it is only theorycrafting. I only posted because OP's playstyle seemed very similar, so I wanted to hear you guys out and see if it is viable or not. Also, I am talking about SCs and not RvR.

Take a look at the mastery tree in game and you will notice a small issue, you should probably go ahead and forget about bringing Empowered transfer for a build like that Either that or commit fully to melee healing, you simply can't spec for AoE detaunt and still get the group cleanse and AoE HoT.

If you still wanna go for facetanking, I'd suggest something like this: http://www.ror.builders/career/disciple ... ,4979,5002

[Penril]

I thought they made AoE detaunt core and moved the AA haste tactic to the DPS tree instead. Was this reverted as well?

(if so, then Career builder needs to be updated )

[lefze]

I thought they made AoE detaunt core and moved the AA haste tactic to the DPS tree instead. Was this reverted as well?

Other way around I think, not entirely sure. Tried editing my last post but **** up so here goes: Would not tkae group cleanse either myself, not good enough to bring unless you play a very competitive 6-man imo.

[Penril]

My spec was aiming to fix 2 issues.

1) Essence regen (Fueled Actions, TE/ET letting you gain Essence while still healing a bit)
2) Survivability (AoE detaunt)

While still trying to play as a "backline" healer (casting spells). If devs reverted the change to AA haste/AoE detaunt tactics positions then nvm; my posts have been completely useless and pointless.

[freshour]

..........

Oh I totally agree taking Dark R. all the way to maximum points and getting Khaine's Refreshment is unbelievably good for warbands. I think when I was doing that 1200 WP spec, it was proc'n for upwards of 650-800 range. But yeah I would argue that unless full melee heals, that it would definitely be more healing than TE. It has **** range, but it also heals out of party which can be good when your Khaine's Invig is on CD.

I still disagree with you about bloodthirst though. If you could only actually see the insignificant amount of damage it adds post nerf you would be shocked. I'm not really saying there is much else worth slotting in the WB spec since you aren't able to get that and Empowered Transfer. But Bloodthirst truthfully is almost no increase in damage. Warbands bomb. If your two tanks and two dps hit one target, or 9 targets, each target can only be hit with 1 bloodthirst every GCD.

The only thing I don't know is if two DoK's in different parties run it, if it can proc more than once on a target. That is just about the only thing that makes it remotely worth it imo. If the heal didn't have a GCD like the WP then obviously that is good for WB's in those "clench" moments since one AOE can proc it multiple times.

Summary: I do agree with your spec for WB play, the spec I was giving was primarily for SC's as it can be difficult sometimes to backline heal and get your AOE hot on all targets since people like to spread out a bit. Khaine's Refreshment is absolutely amazing for Keep Lords as well as those "group up" moments in WB's when you don't wanna burn too much mechanic or if another healer went down. But I also think you need to test bloodthirst... CoV/CoC add fairly insignificant damage now. Snare is really the only thing that makes running a covenant wort hit at all. I'd almost rather them just remove them from the game and give something that was as beneficial as they were before since currently we have two tactics devoted to having better procs - that do basically nothing. But who knows, I tried to fight for it to be changed, I've even posted raw numbers before. But people don't usually go off numbers for some reason.

[freshour]

My spec was aiming to fix 2 issues.

1) Essence regen (Fueled Actions, TE/ET letting you gain Essence while still healing a bit)
2) Survivability (AoE detaunt)

While still trying to play as a "backline" healer (casting spells). If devs reverted the change to AA haste/AoE detaunt tactics positions then nvm; my posts have been completely useless and pointless.

I have done a few BL bosses in melee heal spec with AOE cleanse. It is borderline insane to try and manage your soul essence. If you really want to do the crossover spec, you NEED pillage essence since it restores like 95 SE. Fueled actions is still super helpful as well. Melee heals really need divine fury though which sucks for obvious reasons . For instance max melee healing on a squishie I think is around ~800 ish heals, whereas WP's can get in the 900-1k simply due to the fact that they have a 2h among other tools that make their melee healing spec > DoK melee healing. But I totally think the dual weild while casting AOE hot and some group heals can work. I'd say if the cleanse nerf allowed you to focus on cleansing yourself it'd be a lot easier to pull off so you don't have to switch defensive targets to cleanse and then back to you while you are still in melee range. But idk.. it is definitely a really fun version to play, just hard to make it work.

[lefze]

My spec was aiming to fix 2 issues.

1) Essence regen (Fueled Actions, TE/ET letting you gain Essence while still healing a bit)
2) Survivability (AoE detaunt)

While still trying to play as a "backline" healer (casting spells). If devs reverted the change to AA haste/AoE detaunt tactics positions then nvm; my posts have been completely useless and pointless.

The AoE detaunt is sadly the speccable tactic of the two now. So yeah, the things you aimed to fix won't be fixed by speccing for ET, but it's honestly not even needed, the class is fine Essence wise if you just use essence lash/FoK/blood offering and slot Fueled Actions. The idea of your build can still be achieved just fine, the only thing you will loose is ET which I think is a horrible tactic to spec anyways unless you commit to a full strenght/ws melee healing build. And as we all should know by now, melee healing just isn't viable anyways.

Now I don't personally see any upsides to playing the way you were thinking, as a lot of the ideas of the OP and your build are in essence only crutches.

[Penril]

Like I said, I only thought of this while assuming the AoE detaunt was still core. Disregard all of my previous posts.

F*** current melee healing

[lefze]

..........

Oh I totally agree taking Dark R. all the way to maximum points and getting Khaine's Refreshment is unbelievably good for warbands. I think when I was doing that 1200 WP spec, it was proc'n for upwards of 650-800 range. But yeah I would argue that unless full melee heals, that it would definitely be more healing than TE. It has **** range, but it also heals out of party which can be good when your Khaine's Invig is on CD.

I still disagree with you about bloodthirst though. If you could only actually see the insignificant amount of damage it adds post nerf you would be shocked. I'm not really saying there is much else worth slotting in the WB spec since you aren't able to get that and Empowered Transfer. But Bloodthirst truthfully is almost no increase in damage. Warbands bomb. If your two tanks and two dps hit one target, or 9 targets, each target can only be hit with 1 bloodthirst every GCD.

The only thing I don't know is if two DoK's in different parties run it, if it can proc more than once on a target. That is just about the only thing that makes it remotely worth it imo. If the heal didn't have a GCD like the WP then obviously that is good for WB's in those "clench" moments since one AOE can proc it multiple times.

Summary: I do agree with your spec for WB play, the spec I was giving was primarily for SC's as it can be difficult sometimes to backline heal and get your AOE hot on all targets since people like to spread out a bit. Khaine's Refreshment is absolutely amazing for Keep Lords as well as those "group up" moments in WB's when you don't wanna burn too much mechanic or if another healer went down. But I also think you need to test bloodthirst... CoV/CoC add fairly insignificant damage now. Snare is really the only thing that makes running a covenant wort hit at all. I'd almost rather them just remove them from the game and give something that was as beneficial as they were before since currently we have two tactics devoted to having better procs - that do basically nothing. But who knows, I tried to fight for it to be changed, I've even posted raw numbers before. But people don't usually go off numbers for some reason.

I agree coventants are **** atm, but you litterally got nothing better to slot than Bloodthirst, but again, from a warband perspective. Now I'd of course slot it for scenarios aswell personally, but I haven't played scenarios in a serious environement for months.

Still, a spec like your's works way better in a scneario than warbands obviously, but I still don't see the upside to it unless you are playing with some really awful pugs. As long as you are tanky enough and position well essence is not an issue unless your 2nd healer is absolute trash.

[freshour]

Like I said, I only thought of this while assuming the AoE detaunt was still core. Disregard all of my previous posts.

F*** current melee healing

Yeah I agree. I have tried every possible melee healing spec that you can think of. The real problem is that the DoK was made to have smaller/more frequent hits with AA's and Devour Essence. That is why potent cov's is a tactic for DoK and not WP. ICD changed that and put WP and DoK covs/prayers on par proc wise, except for the healing one which has no ICD.

Technically I think the DoK tactic should allow for more healing than it's WP counter, or get a bonus based off WP to compensate. For if you have a WP and a DoK with same stats, both using their appropriate best in slot weapon. The WP will always melee heal more simply because they have a 2h, so they will always "melee heal" for more. Including their channels. Of course this used to be balanced in that WP could heal more, but did less damage. DoK's did more damage, but healed less. But now there really isn't much sense to go melee healing other than pillage essence. If you could get the overlord set you could technically rely on pillage and channel healing primarily as you'd need PE just to keep your soul essence up to constantly use channel heals. But if you take a WP and a DoK in same gear. WP will usually heal for around 2x their damage. DoK's will heal around 1:1 and sometimes 120% of total damage dealt but very rarely more unless they are constantly hot'ing as well or hitting super tanky targets.