Re: Patch Notes 08/04/2020
Posted: Thu Apr 09, 2020 1:38 pm
The War Private Server
https://returnofreckoning.com/forum/
Those people who preach archetypes also seem to be the ones who preach that this isnt a solo game and it shouldnt be balanced around solo play.Arguetlam wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 1:35 pmWhat i do not get is that ppl think always in archetype. We need to stop thinking like that and see the whole picture.Tartuccio wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 12:41 pmAgreed, I'm just curious as to the design direction, especially with WH/WE. If the plan is for it to never be good at city since it's meant to be rogue archetype then it would be nice to at least know for people to make decisions on what to main. Don't get me wrong, not saying it was as good at city as other classes before the patch (it was passable with morale drain build but still no Slayer/WL) but I'm talking more about the intent for the class.Lesnoj wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 10:25 am I would really like to head thoughts from devs, about what are they planning to do with WH/WE and rSW. It is obviously that they need more attention than other classes that are getting changes every patch. And I am not talking about balance. For example, ranged SW is totally unplayable compared to range SH. Why are we forced to play only mSW or only one spec WH ?
The game is not only about classes, it s about content. So the question is: how each classes integrate itself in the contentent available. And adjuste thing accordingly.
I don t want to chelve a class because the content by it s nature do not have any place for it. I m not talking about making meta any class and any spec in all situation. I m asking for at least usefullness of each class in any content.
It's not preaching, it's an understanding of game design.jokerspsycho wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 1:39 pmThose people who preach archetypes also seem to be the ones who preach that this isnt a solo game and it shouldnt be balanced around solo play.Arguetlam wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 1:35 pmWhat i do not get is that ppl think always in archetype. We need to stop thinking like that and see the whole picture.Tartuccio wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 12:41 pm
Agreed, I'm just curious as to the design direction, especially with WH/WE. If the plan is for it to never be good at city since it's meant to be rogue archetype then it would be nice to at least know for people to make decisions on what to main. Don't get me wrong, not saying it was as good at city as other classes before the patch (it was passable with morale drain build but still no Slayer/WL) but I'm talking more about the intent for the class.
The game is not only about classes, it s about content. So the question is: how each classes integrate itself in the contentent available. And adjuste thing accordingly.
I don t want to chelve a class because the content by it s nature do not have any place for it. I m not talking about making meta any class and any spec in all situation. I m asking for at least usefullness of each class in any content.
Problem is that the "archetype" argument is always used to invalidate attempts to have this pair be relevant or even occasionally desirable, in endgame content. The "assassin" has long since lost ability to assassinate(ironically) and in the current state of the game is basically useless outside their morale drain, as single target is meaningless these days. The archetype no longer seems to have a place in this game so we might as well follow the direction this game is going.Foofmonger wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 1:46 pmIt's not preaching, it's an understanding of game design.jokerspsycho wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 1:39 pmThose people who preach archetypes also seem to be the ones who preach that this isnt a solo game and it shouldnt be balanced around solo play.Arguetlam wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 1:35 pm
What i do not get is that ppl think always in archetype. We need to stop thinking like that and see the whole picture.
The game is not only about classes, it s about content. So the question is: how each classes integrate itself in the contentent available. And adjuste thing accordingly.
I don t want to chelve a class because the content by it s nature do not have any place for it. I m not talking about making meta any class and any spec in all situation. I m asking for at least usefullness of each class in any content.
This game was designed and balanced with multiple sub-systems, including: Cross Realm Archetypes (Bezerker, Aura Tank), In-Realm Roles (Tank,Healer,MDPS,RDPS), Cross Realm Roles (Tank, Healer, MDPS, RDPS, but not same archetype), etc...
If you want to balance the game properly, they must ALL be considered as interlocking systems. Yes, the big picture is the most important, but you can't get to the big picture without understanding the detailed level of nuance that comprises what the big picture "is".
So to the posters point above, you need to consider archetypes and content (and other factors). This is not a "or" discussion, it's an "and". The issue being outlined in this thread is that a particular archetype (the assassin MDPS archetype), doesn't currently have a well defined role in larger AOE based combat situations. That is still an archetype analysis, even when you pair it with specific types of content.
Other classes can do what we/wh does but easier.Foofmonger wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 1:46 pmIt's not preaching, it's an understanding of game design.jokerspsycho wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 1:39 pmThose people who preach archetypes also seem to be the ones who preach that this isnt a solo game and it shouldnt be balanced around solo play.Arguetlam wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 1:35 pm
What i do not get is that ppl think always in archetype. We need to stop thinking like that and see the whole picture.
The game is not only about classes, it s about content. So the question is: how each classes integrate itself in the contentent available. And adjuste thing accordingly.
I don t want to chelve a class because the content by it s nature do not have any place for it. I m not talking about making meta any class and any spec in all situation. I m asking for at least usefullness of each class in any content.
This game was designed and balanced with multiple sub-systems, including: Cross Realm Archetypes (Bezerker, Aura Tank), In-Realm Roles (Tank,Healer,MDPS,RDPS), Cross Realm Roles (Tank, Healer, MDPS, RDPS, but not same archetype), etc...
If you want to balance the game properly, they must ALL be considered as interlocking systems. Yes, the big picture is the most important, but you can't get to the big picture without understanding the detailed level of nuance that comprises what the big picture "is".
So to the posters point above, you need to consider archetypes and content (and other factors). This is not a "or" discussion, it's an "and". The issue being outlined in this thread is that a particular archetype (the assassin MDPS archetype), doesn't currently have a well defined role in larger AOE based combat situations. That is still an archetype analysis, even when you pair it with specific types of content.