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NB poll

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Poll: would you like the nb to return? opinion poll

1 yes I would like the nb to return completely
57
22%
2 no, I don’t want nb to get back. blocking nb was the right decision.
145
56%
3 i do not care.
19
7%
4 I don't care, but if it returns some of the players, then I don't mind.
17
7%
5 I would like the sequencer to be modernized and get some of the functions that nb had (in the comments)
19
7%
Total votes: 257

anarchypark
Posts: 1982

Re: NB poll

Post#81 » Fri Jan 14, 2022 4:57 pm

Secrets wrote:
Wed Jan 12, 2022 7:32 pm

NB is an addon. It was within the restrictions of Mythic's server. Buffing a class or nerfing a class has more of an impact on the possibility than NB does.

You're comparing apples to oranges. Class changes are not the same as removing NB. IMO - class nerfs hurt the game more than anything else. Buffing classes to be like the strongest class in the game is always the better approach compared to nerfing them to be like the weaker ones.
I didn't realize this a few years back. Everyone was in a frenzy of, "Nerf this, nerf that." in most major games.

What I found out in my day job (which is game programming, not design, but I interacted with designers) is that nerfing classes result in less players as players feel like they are weaker and stop playing because you 'ruined their favorite toy' - even if it benefits the rest of the game, losing those players means that those players become vocal, and thus, may encourage others to quit which results in a retention drop.

Since there's no monetary value to players here, the only reason you have to make changes is to make the players' lives more enjoyable. Doing anything contrary to that would result in a drop of players.
There are a few exceptions for exceptionally egregious cases - but in RoR's expansive history, there hasn't been any egregious cases of imbalance without a developer first introducing a nerf to another class.

It's a self-made issue.

I will post one example to close out the argument:
Spoiler:
Rampage. It's class defining for Slayers.
It's also one of the most frequently discussed balance subjects at high end, yet has no tangible metrics to warrant its change.

A majority of DPS lack a critical defining skill like Rampage. A proper solution is to not nerf rampage (or any other perceived imbalance) but evaluate whether or not a class has a class-defining skill like that:
Shadow Warrior/SH does not. Closest thing they have is spirit bypass in Scout/Big Shootin', which isn't as good as Slayer.
White Lion had Coordinated Strike (DoTs after CS was nerfed)
Bright Wizard/Sorc has a short, low mitigation burst window.
Mara has nothing like that.
WE/WH have armor bypass and high armor pen, alongside spell immunity, WE with WL's core ability, etc...
Choppa has the ability to grant people immunities. They're high AOE damage, but not nearly as Slayer with ID among other abilities.
Tanks have no mitigation ability to rival that bypass.
Healers have no mitigation / healing to rival that bypass beyond absorbs, which are just a core gameplay mechanic.
Engineer/Magus, while they have potentially high burst, do not have the level of movement slayer has.
DPS AM/WP/DoK/Shaman do not rival that with any ability.

Out of these, only WE/WH/BW/Sorc have anything to rival that mitigation / defense bypass.

we've journeyed too far from subtle 'buff upward' course.
there's been too steep buffs. Engie 8 stacks, guardian WL, BO cd decrease, SW 3 stacks etc.
at first it may look balanced but in 100vs100 massive battles it may not.
nerfs were necessary. ( technically -10 after +10 is not really a nerf )

industry doesn't want nerfs because they lose subscribers.
without nerf options, it's alternative solution IMO.
not arguing professional designer, just my 2cent.

tank/heal is spine of grp. they always face hostiles.
OP dps hurts their population. mostly healers.
chased by OP dps, running like on fire screaming help and die, would you play it again?
without tank/heal, would you play game?

hopeless, insta defeat is most negative to the game. like 40 lvl killing in starter zone.
zerg, premade vs pug lowbie stomp and OP skills are example.
block/parry 40 rr invested feat's ignored by 1 skill, such level of power's not necessary across all dps.

it stings when winner's toy got nerfed, but it's for better pvp.
because pvp always create losers. and quitting happens when your badass hero became hopeless loser.

if everyone is dps, like fps, you can buff them all.
not in tank/dps/heal trio mmorpg game.
unless you buff tank/heal too.
SM8, SW8, AM8, WL7, KoBS5, BW5, WP8, WH7, IB7, Eng5, RP5, SL6
BG7, Sorc6, DoK8, WE7, Chs8, Mg8, Ze6, Mara7, BO5, SH7, Shm5, Chop4
SC summary - viewtopic.php?f=8&t=20415
( last update : 2020.06.09)

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btbw2009
Suspended
Posts: 101

Re: NB poll

Post#82 » Sat Jan 15, 2022 12:47 am

daje88 wrote:
Fri Jan 14, 2022 3:31 pm
Either you're a 12 yo spoiled kid, or you are just a troll. Don't reply, answer will not be read.
did u google "mouse freeze" issue?

User avatar
dwyur
Posts: 56
Contact:

Re: NB poll

Post#83 » Sat Jan 15, 2022 5:16 am

wonshot wrote:
Sun Jan 09, 2022 11:06 pm
Voted 2,
my reasoning being that melee styles (coming from a Daoc background) should be rewarded with good positioning on your next global cooldown swing, I didnt feel NB doing possitional checks for you was rewarding melee players pulling this off.

As for my own perspective of which addons that should be allowed or not, my ideology goes to when an addon gives you information (state of the realm, Enemy buffhead, tether etc) but the player still needs to do player input and make choices based on those information.

As i understand it, NB was removing some of the choices in high pressure situations and allowing to auto interrupt Challened attacks without the player might even have noticed the Challening annimation in the first place which seem too automated imho.
/endthread
Dirkfunk - 67 Runepriest
Maala - 67 DoK
Durtknap - 65 Choppa
Dwyur - 63 Sorc

btbw2009
Suspended
Posts: 101

Re: NB poll

Post#84 » Sat Jan 15, 2022 1:47 pm

wonshot wrote:
Sun Jan 09, 2022 11:06 pm
Voted 2,
As i understand it, NB was removing some of the choices in high pressure situations and allowing to auto interrupt Challened attacks without the player might even have noticed the Challening annimation in the first place which seem too automated imho.
its myth and lie
NB cannot found channeled attacks and automatically interrupt it
NB have channel trigger but only for YOU, not enemy target

emiliorv
Posts: 1278

Re: NB poll

Post#85 » Mon Jan 17, 2022 1:15 pm

wonshot wrote:
Sun Jan 09, 2022 11:06 pm
Voted 2,
my reasoning being that melee styles (coming from a Daoc background) should be rewarded with good positioning on your next global cooldown swing, I didnt feel NB doing possitional checks for you was rewarding melee players pulling this off.
The daoc combat system is way different....and also in daoc you can preselect 2 attacks for the next swing...usually you select first 1 style that need a parry/dodge/parry as opening and second a None style...when character performs the swing the game check if you meets the requeriment for the first style selected, if true perform that attacks...if false then check for requeriments for style 2...

This can be done selecting forst attack as a positional (second none)....ppl usually do this while straffing and try to land a positional...

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