Recent Topics

Ads

Chosen - Tzeentch's Reflection

We want to hear your thoughts and ideas.
Forum rules
Before posting on this forum, be sure to read the Terms of Use

Structured class balance suggestions belong in the Balance Proposal subforum. Class-related discussion in this section are considered as ongoing debates and ARE NOT reviewed for balance changes.
User avatar
zulnam
Posts: 760

Chosen - Tzeentch's Reflection

Post#1 » Thu May 06, 2021 8:27 pm

I was looking over Chosen and what abilities seem paricularly pointless and every time, Tzeentch's Reflection comes first. Honestly I don't know why anyone would pick it.

So the abilit tooltip states:
Spoiler:
You are surrounded by a magical barrier, increasing your willpower by 75 and disrupt chance by 25% for 10 seconds. During this time, any spell you disrupt will sillence the caster for 3 seconds. [30 second cooldown]
Let's break it down

75 willpower = on a tank, useless
25% disrupt = very good in certain situations
ranged silence = questionable at best. It gies a free immunity and is uncontrollable. If you use it you might just accidentally give immunities to the target your ST group is aiming for.

But I see an opportunity here. A chance to make a pointless ability into a useful group one. Chosen, while having auras, still lacks that certain umpf their Order counterpart has, mainly due to their lack of helpful group abilities.

So instead of what it is now, how about this:

Option 1:
You and your party are surrounded by a magical barrier, increasing the party's wounds by 75 and your disrupt chance by 25% for 20 seconds. [30 second cooldown]

Breakdown
75 wounds - for a party, this would be great. This is a buff type that Destro is completely missing in their arsenal (WP's Sigmar's Grace). It still lasts 10 seconds, so it is weaker than the counterpart, but again a strong buff. It can include or exclude the chosen tank casting it.
25% disrupt = continues to be very good in certain situations.
ranged silence = dropped entirely. There's little point in keeping this for organised play as uncontrolled immunity givers are a big no-no. Any ability that would do this would be greatly frowned upon.


Option 2:
You and your party are surrounded by a magical barrier, increasing the party's wounds by 75 for 20 seconds. During this time, any direct damage dealing spell cast agaisnt you will return anywhere between 25% and 50% of the damage to it's caster.[30 second cooldown]

Breakdown
75 wounds - still very good, same reasoning.
25% disrupt - dropped entirely for:
25% - 50% magical reflect - this would be a more exotic version of the ability. It would be an interesting damage reflect that would make casters be more on their toes when it comes to fighting groups with chosen in them. It would also be more in theme with the ability name, reflection. Also damage reflect range cause TZEENTCH DON'T GIVE A FFFFFFF. You think you're his favorite boy when OOPS /GKICK.

Will put this here for some feedback before I create a proposal on the Balance subforum.
SW, Kotbs, IB, Slayer, WP, WL, SM, Mara, SH, BG

Ads
User avatar
space44
Posts: 480

Re: Chosen - Tzeentch's Reflection

Post#2 » Thu May 06, 2021 9:01 pm

although its a good meme ability ive also thought it would be better if it effected the whole party but it has 6 charges. different individual spell casters casting on the player with the buff gets silenced for 3 seconds and all heals casted on the silenced target is reduced by 45% but 1 charge is used up, it cannot affect the same victim twice while the buff is active. whenever a charge is used up the player is guaranteed to dodge and disrupt for 2 second and the timer can stack.
Chosen: Roten Plaguelord rr86 | Knight of the Blazing Sun: Lyntyz Jesterknight rr63

I'm not a clown, I'm the whole circus.

User avatar
Aethilmar
Posts: 636

Re: Chosen - Tzeentch's Reflection

Post#3 » Thu May 06, 2021 9:37 pm

I see your point about the silence. Otherwise it is a solid ability. It is a 25% disrupt + some percent from willpower increase when needed. Seems like a win to me if you are being pounded by magical caster types (which Order has a bunch of).

User avatar
sharpblader
Posts: 298

Re: Chosen - Tzeentch's Reflection

Post#4 » Thu May 06, 2021 9:50 pm

Spoiler:
zulnam wrote: Thu May 06, 2021 8:27 pm I was looking over Chosen and what abilities seem paricularly pointless and every time, Tzeentch's Reflection comes first. Honestly I don't know why anyone would pick it.

So the abilit tooltip states:
Spoiler:
You are surrounded by a magical barrier, increasing your willpower by 75 and disrupt chance by 25% for 10 seconds. During this time, any spell you disrupt will sillence the caster for 3 seconds. [30 second cooldown]
Let's break it down

75 willpower = on a tank, useless
25% disrupt = very good in certain situations
ranged silence = questionable at best. It gies a free immunity and is uncontrollable. If you use it you might just accidentally give immunities to the target your ST group is aiming for.

But I see an opportunity here. A chance to make a pointless ability into a useful group one. Chosen, while having auras, still lacks that certain umpf their Order counterpart has, mainly due to their lack of helpful group abilities.

So instead of what it is now, how about this:

Option 1:
You and your party are surrounded by a magical barrier, increasing the party's wounds by 75 and your disrupt chance by 25% for 20 seconds. [30 second cooldown]

Breakdown
75 wounds - for a party, this would be great. This is a buff type that Destro is completely missing in their arsenal (WP's Sigmar's Grace). It still lasts 10 seconds, so it is weaker than the counterpart, but again a strong buff. It can include or exclude the chosen tank casting it.
25% disrupt = continues to be very good in certain situations.
ranged silence = dropped entirely. There's little point in keeping this for organised play as uncontrolled immunity givers are a big no-no. Any ability that would do this would be greatly frowned upon.


Option 2:
You and your party are surrounded by a magical barrier, increasing the party's wounds by 75 for 20 seconds. During this time, any direct damage dealing spell cast agaisnt you will return anywhere between 25% and 50% of the damage to it's caster.[30 second cooldown]

Breakdown
75 wounds - still very good, same reasoning.
25% disrupt - dropped entirely for:
25% - 50% magical reflect - this would be a more exotic version of the ability. It would be an interesting damage reflect that would make casters be more on their toes when it comes to fighting groups with chosen in them. It would also be more in theme with the ability name, reflection. Also damage reflect range cause TZEENTCH DON'T GIVE A FFFFFFF. You think you're his favorite boy when OOPS /GKICK.

Will put this here for some feedback before I create a proposal on the Balance subforum.
Some feedback:

1. BOs already have a wounds buff for party with an application identical to the way you have proposed. Hence, would seem repetitive.

2. In the current state, the willpower increases the Chosen's disrupt a bit higher so that the ability can land. But agreed, its very meh, and might need changes.

3. Chosen already has a lot of reflection in their toolkit. If a caster casts a spell on the chosen, they might get hit by Disc. Fluctuation, Bane Shield and Backlash, which along with more reflection damage could theoretically surpass the initial damage the caster does.

User avatar
Detangler
Posts: 986

Re: Chosen - Tzeentch's Reflection

Post#5 » Fri May 07, 2021 12:46 am

The ranged silence is really only useful for funnels. Gives a brief break from the BW damage spam as you run through a door to everyone else, and can push your disrupt rate to the 80s along with HtL and the additional +willpower.
Detangler and alts - 84 Chosen, other 40s - DoK, Zealot, SH, WE, BG, BO
Destro - Mostly Harmless
Tangler and alts - 8X IB, other 40s - RP, SM
Order - Most dishonorable

User avatar
detrap
Posts: 352
Contact:

Re: Chosen - Tzeentch's Reflection

Post#6 » Fri May 07, 2021 2:29 am

Not factoring strikethrough, the bonus to willpower ≈ 3% extra disrupt so it's probably been there to negate any potential willpower debuffs that could affect the 25% disrupt buff.
Knight 8x - IB 8x - SM 8x / Chosen 3x - BO 4x - BG 5x

User avatar
zulnam
Posts: 760

Re: Chosen - Tzeentch's Reflection

Post#7 » Fri May 07, 2021 9:51 am

Right. I see most people see it more useful than i do and i don't have enough experience on chosen to argue further so let's leave it at that.
SW, Kotbs, IB, Slayer, WP, WL, SM, Mara, SH, BG

arorwne
Suspended
Posts: 235

Re: Chosen - Tzeentch's Reflection

Post#8 » Fri May 07, 2021 2:11 pm

What if it simply lost the silence part? Maybe could gain like 5s as a recompense of sorts. Something like this:

"+25% Disrupt ; +75WLL. 15s duration / 30s CD"

Would effectively give you some 13-14% Disrupt, that's good.

Ads
User avatar
space44
Posts: 480

Re: Chosen - Tzeentch's Reflection

Post#9 » Fri May 07, 2021 9:12 pm

i find silence to be a huge part of that ability its just how to give it out is sketch.
Chosen: Roten Plaguelord rr86 | Knight of the Blazing Sun: Lyntyz Jesterknight rr63

I'm not a clown, I'm the whole circus.

User avatar
Evilest
Posts: 168

Re: Chosen - Tzeentch's Reflection

Post#10 » Thu May 13, 2021 2:28 pm

Classes were not designed to have ICDs or give immunities. And when mythic found out they needed to introduce them they didn't really bother to readjust much.

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 24 guests