haha ok, that's a reach but ok As long as you don't want to do anything beside stance dot stance slow I guess that works...kinda
[SH] Ranged knock down has to go
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Structured class balance suggestions belong in the Balance Proposal subforum. Class-related discussion in this section are considered as ongoing debates and ARE NOT reviewed for balance changes.
Re: [SH] Ranged knock down has to go
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Re: [SH] Ranged knock down has to go
LOL!!! I rarely ever post on these forums, but this IS the funniest post I have ever read! Thank you! Order has had three ranged knock downs since day one of live Warhammer (I don't count pistol whip - only 30 foot range). Until recently, Destro has had none. So as an Order player, you get to finally enjoy the rapture that is a ranged knock down. Welcome to the party. Have fun!
Re: [SH] Ranged knock down has to go
Works for our guild's Shadow Sniper Team
You get to use scout dots while running. Skirmish "on the move" skills. It's not like all you're doing during those 5s is planning your escape. Running away to knockdown and burst works too.
SWs have way more mobility than SHs. Change my mind
RoR: Burszui SH, Ropopuch SHM<|[]|>Ginnar IB, Vidarr HMR, Runatyr RP ++ REV guild ++
Live: Karak Izor -> Karak Norn - Yarpaen IB, Ginnarr SL, Volundr ENG +Ithilmar's Chosen+
* * * playing 19 classes - running out of char slots * * *
Live: Karak Izor -> Karak Norn - Yarpaen IB, Ginnarr SL, Volundr ENG +Ithilmar's Chosen+
* * * playing 19 classes - running out of char slots * * *
Re: [SH] Ranged knock down has to go
GCD is 1.15sec
To keep your oh so good SW mobility as you want to do it, you can cast 4 skills, then have to stance swap, that's 25.3% of your time not interacting with enemies (cuz u r also losing 0.4sec waiting for your stance CD). There is a better way to do it, but i'm doing the maths on what you described, so don't blame the maths.
So you take your damage, remove 25.3% of it, realize you are doing a disservice to everybody doing it, and stop.
While we are at it, can we stop saying SW got 100ft range and SH 65ft plz ? SH also got a 100ft range mastery tree. And yes i'm well aware noone wants to use it cause there is a better tree out there, but that's the exact same for SW...
To keep your oh so good SW mobility as you want to do it, you can cast 4 skills, then have to stance swap, that's 25.3% of your time not interacting with enemies (cuz u r also losing 0.4sec waiting for your stance CD). There is a better way to do it, but i'm doing the maths on what you described, so don't blame the maths.
So you take your damage, remove 25.3% of it, realize you are doing a disservice to everybody doing it, and stop.
While we are at it, can we stop saying SW got 100ft range and SH 65ft plz ? SH also got a 100ft range mastery tree. And yes i'm well aware noone wants to use it cause there is a better tree out there, but that's the exact same for SW...
Re: [SH] Ranged knock down has to go
Earthcake wrote: ↑Thu Jan 21, 2021 8:31 pm GCD is 1.15sec
To keep your oh so good SW mobility as you want to do it, you can cast 4 skills, then have to stance swap, that's 20% of your time not interacting with enemies.
So you take your damage, remove 20% of it, and then realize you are doing a disservice to everybody doing it, and stop.
While we are at it, can we stop saying SW got 100ft range and SH 65ft plz ? SH also got a 100ft range mastery tree. And yes i'm well aware noone wants to use it cause there is a better tree out there, but that's the exact same for SW...
1.15 sec, sorry, my perception of time is not that acute.
Difference is SH Big Shooting tree keeps you rooted in place for way too long. Ever since run away the tactic nerf you cannot "catch" a dot and have speed buff to relocate. Quick shooting is all 65ft (80 buffed) - dots, debuffs, burst. SWs Skirmisher is 65ft for aoe and 100ft for ST.
SWs Scout path is also quicker than Big Shooting - poison arrer/fester, plink/eagle eye and armour debuff are the same but Big shootin' has that reworked 3s explodin arrer knock back that just extends rotation beyond reasonable time in battlefield situations (works great for stationary sieges though). A bit of a wasted skill slot (kinda like poison arrer in quick shooting build, highly situational but too long to make it's way to standard rotation).
A gobbo that stands still for more that 2 seconds is a dead gobbo more often than not. So you kite and I guess, to quote your words, "then realize you are doing a disservice to everybody doing it, and stop".
Please understand, I'm NOT advocating a nerf. I'm pointing out that those pastures are always greener on the other side. And I play both sides
Last edited by NSKaneda on Thu Jan 21, 2021 9:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
RoR: Burszui SH, Ropopuch SHM<|[]|>Ginnar IB, Vidarr HMR, Runatyr RP ++ REV guild ++
Live: Karak Izor -> Karak Norn - Yarpaen IB, Ginnarr SL, Volundr ENG +Ithilmar's Chosen+
* * * playing 19 classes - running out of char slots * * *
Live: Karak Izor -> Karak Norn - Yarpaen IB, Ginnarr SL, Volundr ENG +Ithilmar's Chosen+
* * * playing 19 classes - running out of char slots * * *
Re: [SH] Ranged knock down has to go
How is a SW standing still for more than 2 seconds any different? For that matter see ^^CommentNSKaneda wrote: ↑Thu Jan 21, 2021 8:58 pmEarthcake wrote: ↑Thu Jan 21, 2021 8:31 pm GCD is 1.15sec
To keep your oh so good SW mobility as you want to do it, you can cast 4 skills, then have to stance swap, that's 20% of your time not interacting with enemies.
So you take your damage, remove 20% of it, and then realize you are doing a disservice to everybody doing it, and stop.
While we are at it, can we stop saying SW got 100ft range and SH 65ft plz ? SH also got a 100ft range mastery tree. And yes i'm well aware noone wants to use it cause there is a better tree out there, but that's the exact same for SW...
1.15 sec, sorry, my perception of time is not that acute.
Difference is SH Big Shooting tree keeps you rooted in place for way too long. Ever since run away the tactic nerf you cannot "catch" a dot and have speed buff to relocate. Quick shooting is all 65ft (80 buffed) - dots, debuffs, burst. SWs Skirmisher is 65ft for aoe and 100ft for ST. (And SH is AoE mele vs Single target...single target in a game designed around Mele AoE)
SWs Scout path is also quicker than Big Shooting - poison arrer/fester, plink/eagle eye and armour debuff are the same but Big shootin' has that reworked 3s explodin arrer knock back that just extends rotation beyond reasonable time in battlefield situations (works great for stationary sieges though). A bit of a wasted skill slot (kinda like poison arrer in quick shooting build, highly situational but too long to make it's way to standard rotation).
A gobbo that stands still for more that 2 seconds is a dead gobbo more often than not. So you kite and I guess, to quote your words, "then realize you are doing a disservice to everybody doing it, and stop".
EDIT" Maybe they should just make the trees mirror Left - 100' Single Target Statiionary - Middle (Mele either AoE or Single - Right 65" On the Move For both classes.
Last edited by Akalukz on Thu Jan 21, 2021 9:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: [SH] Ranged knock down has to go
You don't rely on pet, cooldown or dmg to have speed buff to relocate to safe distance. We're circling back to the begining.
RoR: Burszui SH, Ropopuch SHM<|[]|>Ginnar IB, Vidarr HMR, Runatyr RP ++ REV guild ++
Live: Karak Izor -> Karak Norn - Yarpaen IB, Ginnarr SL, Volundr ENG +Ithilmar's Chosen+
* * * playing 19 classes - running out of char slots * * *
Live: Karak Izor -> Karak Norn - Yarpaen IB, Ginnarr SL, Volundr ENG +Ithilmar's Chosen+
* * * playing 19 classes - running out of char slots * * *
Re: [SH] Ranged knock down has to go
pet has already been determined a non issue as you have what 3 to choose from. Nope we need to waste a tactic for speed buff and swap stances.
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Re: [SH] Ranged knock down has to go
Quick Shootin vs SkirmNSKaneda wrote: ↑Thu Jan 21, 2021 8:58 pmEarthcake wrote: ↑Thu Jan 21, 2021 8:31 pm GCD is 1.15sec
To keep your oh so good SW mobility as you want to do it, you can cast 4 skills, then have to stance swap, that's 20% of your time not interacting with enemies.
So you take your damage, remove 20% of it, and then realize you are doing a disservice to everybody doing it, and stop.
While we are at it, can we stop saying SW got 100ft range and SH 65ft plz ? SH also got a 100ft range mastery tree. And yes i'm well aware noone wants to use it cause there is a better tree out there, but that's the exact same for SW...
1.15 sec, sorry, my perception of time is not that acute.
Difference is SH Big Shooting tree keeps you rooted in place for way too long. Ever since run away the tactic nerf you cannot "catch" a dot and have speed buff to relocate. Quick shooting is all 65ft (80 buffed) - dots, debuffs, burst. SWs Skirmisher is 65ft for aoe and 100ft for ST.
SWs Scout path is also quicker than Big Shooting - poison arrer/fester, plink/eagle eye and armour debuff are the same but Big shootin' has that reworked 3s explodin arrer knock back that just extends rotation beyond reasonable time in battlefield situations (works great for stationary sieges though). A bit of a wasted skill slot (kinda like poison arrer in quick shooting build, highly situational but too long to make it's way to standard rotation).
A gobbo that stands still for more that 2 seconds is a dead gobbo more often than not. So you kite and I guess, to quote your words, "then realize you are doing a disservice to everybody doing it, and stop".
Not to mention the new cooldown on Yer Bleedin which makes it an unreliable dot as well as making the heal debuff even more unreliable since 2 abilities need to not get dodge/blocked. Shrapnel Arrer is no longer a viable way to reliably cast the HD either since the 10s initiative debuff was removed. This means rSW can layer dots (constant damage) and burst while rSH has to rely on direct damage burst for most of it's damage.
BHA spam 3x stack at 100 feet with no cooldown is the clear winner here. Can it be cleansed? Yep...but then you can go right back to stacking your dots. Sure the heal debuff is on 65 ft range but it can also be made undefendable with VoN.
Big Shootin vs Scout
On the topic of the RKD...the initiative debuff is tied to the freakin RKD. Add in Bulleseye for even more crit and add VoN to add a whopping 25% damage to an undefendable Fester...it's not even close.
Sure rSH has more escape tools...but don't tell me that rSW isn't as strong.
Re: [SH] Ranged knock down has to go
Tankbeardz wrote: ↑Thu Jan 21, 2021 9:18 pmSure rSH has more escape tools...but don't tell me that rSW isn't as strong.Spoiler:
SWs are very strong indeed. Like I've written: nerf not. Learn how to hunt them
RoR: Burszui SH, Ropopuch SHM<|[]|>Ginnar IB, Vidarr HMR, Runatyr RP ++ REV guild ++
Live: Karak Izor -> Karak Norn - Yarpaen IB, Ginnarr SL, Volundr ENG +Ithilmar's Chosen+
* * * playing 19 classes - running out of char slots * * *
Live: Karak Izor -> Karak Norn - Yarpaen IB, Ginnarr SL, Volundr ENG +Ithilmar's Chosen+
* * * playing 19 classes - running out of char slots * * *