WH/WE balance suggestion - AOE dmg reduction tactic

[Duukar]

In larger SCs and Warband combat in general the constant aoe damage is so great that even with a dedicated guard you are a detriment to your team. To get execution points as a WH(never played a WE) you need to land shots so it becomes a critical risk reward scenario. The reward is not worth the risk in most cases. Basically you need to engage to be effective, but engaging is very bad for your healers resources and tank life.


My Solution - A tactic for WH/WE that reduces incoming AOE damage. 30-50% would be perfect. It costs a tactic slot which is a trade off. It would allow WE/WH who choose the tactic to engage on the frontline without the huge penalty of dropping soo many WB resources so quickly in a losing battle to keep you alive. From the lore side it could be called "Nimble" to reflect the elusive nature of the WE/WH in light armor.

Another nice addition to this tactic which could really make WH/WE desirable in WBs would be to extend a portion of the AOE dmg reduction to allies within 30 feet.

For example - Reduces 30% aoe dmg. When you are the victim of critical aoe dmg reduce aoe dmg for allies within 30 feet by 15% for 5 seconds.

I propose a 50% reduction if it will just affect the WE/WH and a 30% reduction if when the victim of a crit 15% extends to those within 30 feet.

Please have a look and let me know what you think. This would improve QoL for WH/WE without adding huge damage or changing any other part of their kit in a major way.

Thanks!

[MMXX43]

+ for that , aoe whs are very dependable in city ( their only utility is aoe morale-pump-drain) and very weak vs aoe damage

[Duukar]

Ok after speaking with some other players how does 35% aoe dmg reduction but stealth is disabled sound?

I would gladly trade stealth for at least some ability to hang in a warband.

[Melkoroth]

Interesting proposal but I doubt the fact of being wanted in a WB comes only from the ability of dying less though. I see the tactic as an upgrade from light armor to be maybe on par with other MDPS but without their DMG. That's still IMO not worth replacing a slayer, for example.

With good gear, guard and timed challenges, competent healers and proper use of detaunt you can more or less survive the melee train AoE but, in any case, why would you want to be in there even if you're less a liability to your team if your AoE is so much limited? I feel I'm much more useful just AoE heal-debuffing and putting pressure in the healers while morale-draining.

I see "melee" BW's explode quicker than I do and they are better looked at mainly because they can top DMG charts and have two group buffs.

[adamthelc]

I personally am not a fan of WH/WE in larger scale fights, but the best ones can make it work.

The stealth mechanic doesn't provide much in a long drawn out fight, but I am not sure it needs to. What you are suggesting is definitely not a QoL change.

How is that DR going to stack with guard? Are you saying a guarded WH should only take 35-25% damage from AoE?

And no to giving other people DR. That is tank type support, no good reason to give it to WH/WE.

Not a big fan of the suggestion. I dont think a WH/WE needs to be an auto pick in WB play for every player.

[Wiede]

WH/WE is DPS and a pretty hard hitting dps... there shouldn't be a defense buff.

Just rework slice again to hit any target (or 9) in an AoE (as it was at buggy times) and balance the damage reduction on it to be kinda on par with e.g. slayer in red.
Think this alone would be enough.

[Arcrival]

AOE damage is too high period especially if its stacked. I would rather see a nerf to all AOE damage its too high. As for WH they need to move up to medium armor and there damage needs to be tweaked some all the defensive buffs and changes that have been done in the past coupled with no changes or tweaks to WH damage out put gave them a passive nerf. So its basically hey your survivability sucks and you can't damage down people sooo hey you got a hat.

[Duukar]

AOE damage is too high period especially if its stacked. I would rather see a nerf to all AOE damage its too high. As for WH they need to move up to medium armor and there damage needs to be tweaked some all the defensive buffs and changes that have been done in the past coupled with no changes or tweaks to WH damage out put gave them a passive nerf. So its basically hey your survivability sucks and you can't damage down people sooo hey you got a hat.

Yeah something like this would work, but hasn't this been suggested a bunch of times and been passed over? I'm trying to find a new angle so something gets done sooner than later. Perhaps a tactic that allows accusations to be built outside of combat so the DG pump can become useful without dying trying to get a charge or two of accusation? Guarding a target in light armor with little in the way of defense VS aoe is a bit suicidal.

all the targets are so stacked up there is no way to engage and avoid the aoe. Plus sometimes even in stealth you get randomly pulled from miles away by a choppa.

[Alfa1986]

in order to make it competitive in the warband, you need to do one simple thing, namely, to increase the number of targets from the tactics aoe "broad severing" for the "slice" from 2 to 24 and to increase the radius of action "slice". otherwise it’s just some kind of laugh, for some reason BW can give out aoe 1k DPS * 24 targets in sec, but WE can’t because "he is so very strong class"? WE a strong class? Yes, it is absolutely useless in the RVR and it is played only for fun, in the gank groups. there is no armor, no resist, class which intended as killer of healers is not to be able kill any normal exp healer even 1 on 1.

[Xergon]

in order to make it competitive in the warband, you need to do one simple thing, namely, to increase the number of targets from the tactics aoe "broad severing" for the "slice" from 2 to 24 and to increase the radius of action "slice". otherwise it’s just some kind of laugh, for some reason BW can give out aoe 1k DPS * 24 targets in sec, but WE can’t because "he is so very strong class"? WE a strong class? Yes, it is absolutely useless in the RVR and it is played only for fun, in the gank groups. there is no armor, no resist, class which intended as killer of healers is not to be able kill any normal exp healer even 1 on 1.

24 targets is maybe too much, 9 targets with equiped tactic sounds reasonable.

Also, could maybe make or add one more requirement if u want to do AoE, for example, for each combo point u have, u hit 1 additional target. Something like this, would be a change which require play along with ClassMechanic and its not easy boost, while also force player to decide when he wants to keep AoEing more targets or use finishers and lose potential to do additional AoE.

option 1:
- Sweeping Razor / Broad Severing : RazorStrike/Slice will now also hits up to 3 additional enemies within 25feet of your target. Additional, you can hit one more target for each combo point you have. (removing 10% dmg nerf in comparisson to current one), (1+3+5 = 9 max total targets)

option 2:
- Sweeping Razor / Broad Severing : RazorStrike/Slice become ability that hits upto 4 targets in 90degree arc infront, but deals 10% less damage. (something similar to Aza proposal). Additional, you can hit one more target for each combo point you have. (4 + 5 = 9 max total targets)

option 3:
- Trial By Pain / Ruthless Assault - becomes AoE, and hits 1/2 more target in 30ft range for each ComboPoint spent (6/12 max total targets)

option 4:
- Blessed Bullets of Cleansing - make it possible to drain AP from every target hitted and give stolen AP to group. (would require some number checks if it would be not too strong)

But anyway, no matter what we will proposal or think off, current devs stand is that this class should not be an AoE class so very unlikely it will get any AoE love.

If ppl think, no AoE on Stealth class, then could also add to AoE tactic You lose ability to use Incognito/ShadowProwler but still could use Elixir of Shadows or Sanctified Oil.