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Balancing Kotbs VS Chossen!

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warhammer12345
Posts: 32

Re: Balancing Kotbs VS Chossen!

Post#11 » Mon Mar 23, 2020 9:33 pm

Nefarian78 wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 8:29 pm
warhammer12345 wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 8:26 pm
I just hear mimimi from a Destro. Play a kotbs and try to kick a 75% Parri chossen. It is damn impossible.

Answers Better to my questions than to cry.
I'm at 62% unbuffed parry on my BO + an additional 15% from You Wot?!. Does that make BO op?
No OP not. As a BO you move in the same values ​​as an SM. So far so good. IB / BG is also okay. From the values. The only class is the Kotbs that cannot keep up in the values. And that annoys me.

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gke96
Posts: 84

Re: Balancing Kotbs VS Chossen!

Post#12 » Mon Mar 23, 2020 9:46 pm

that is a gear issue, kotbs 2H bis gear has 54 bonus parry on small scale, (unfortunately not a single piece from sovereign/warlord). offensive sovereign only giving 2 total parry is the only problem here. Also chosen is obviously underperforming compared to kotbs in smallscale, one parry buff cant be compared to lack of utility

Also chosen doesnt have "decent" damage, kotbs is lowest dps class in game while chosen is 2nd lowest dps class in game, getting damage isnt worth it for either of them. Both stack parry & striketrough if decent player
HORSEWHISPERER - PHALANX
CHOPPPA - PHALANX
SUNWHISPERER - ZERG

JohnJJ
Posts: 3

Re: Balancing Kotbs VS Chossen!

Post#13 » Mon Mar 23, 2020 9:48 pm

Nefarian78 wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 8:29 pm
warhammer12345 wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 8:26 pm
I just hear mimimi from a Destro. Play a kotbs and try to kick a 75% Parri chossen. It is damn impossible.

Answers Better to my questions than to cry.
I'm at 62% unbuffed parry on my BO + an additional 15% from You Wot?!. Does that make BO op?
Nope, you are on the same lvl like IB with 25% Parry Buff / BG with 30% Parry tactic/ SM with 25% Parry Skill and Chosen with 25% Parry Skill, have i forgot one Tank?

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wargrimnir
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Re: Balancing Kotbs VS Chossen!

Post#14 » Mon Mar 23, 2020 9:51 pm

I believe the true progamer move is to simply walk behind them and punt.
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grimnir.me Some old WAR blog

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kmark101
Posts: 326

Re: Balancing Kotbs VS Chossen!

Post#15 » Tue Mar 24, 2020 4:12 am

JohnJJ wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 9:48 pm

Nope, you are on the same lvl like IB with 25% Parry Buff / BG with 30% Parry tactic/ SM with 25% Parry Skill and Chosen with 25% Parry Skill, have i forgot one Tank?
This was balanced out with Runefang giving you huge survival and damage buff in case you parry, so parry couldn't be super high for Kotbs. Again, Runefang was the reason cause it was a very powerful tactic, even with lower parry, so you should just use it if you need to be on same level as a Chosen overall... oh wait :(
Gryyw - Ironbreaker

teiloh
Posts: 246

Re: Balancing Kotbs VS Chossen!

Post#16 » Tue Mar 24, 2020 10:32 am

ahorts wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 9:09 pm

The game is not balanced 1v1, Chosen and KOTBS are not perfect mirror classes: Chosen has more parry and does more damage than KOTBS, KOTBS has better group utility, which more than makes up for what Chosen has.
Because of Focused Mending? The Chosen has plenty of group/WB utility.

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MightyPhred
Posts: 48

Re: Balancing Kotbs VS Chossen!

Post#17 » Tue Mar 24, 2020 11:09 am

1. several of the changes you propose would lead to cross class skills being identical...do you have any idea how boring the game would be if the mirror classes were exactly the same?

2. if you want to beat a parry stacking chosen in 1v1 melee combat, you dont do it by trying to beat through his parry, you do it by getting behind him, or using undefendable/damage returning skills - in the knights case he has the dmg aura, shield of the sun and the melee dmg return aura, use those with a tank setup and youll beat most melee people

3. consider the game lore - a chosen is f***in massive, hes about twice the size of a regular human and far more muscled, its pretty safe to assume that he can swing a two handed sword around a lot faster than any imperial knight, and considering the violent nature of chaos worshippers it stands to reason that hes put a lot more practice into swinging big swords and axes around than using a shield, hence the reason he gets no block buff and returns magical damage instead of melee, which is significantly less useful in general because melee classes tend to strike a lot of hits giving you many chances to return damage, magical classes tend to use dots or much higher hitting skills in fewer numbers, giving less chances to return damage on them

just because there isnt a 1:1 win ratio between mirror classes dosnt mean that either they or the game as a whole are imbalanced, this game has to take into account the general usefulness of an army, rather than just your personal ability to beat up the other guy

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Jinxypie
Posts: 185

Re: Balancing Kotbs VS Chossen!

Post#18 » Tue Mar 24, 2020 11:14 am

warhammer12345 wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 8:19 pm

My speech is now about KLotbs vs Chosen. I don't want to go into Slayer and Choppa. I'm interested in the two classes. Kotbs Chossen. Not more.
And thats the problem, cuz slayers just pop Rampage and poof... theres no parry or block anymore. Not 70% not 50% not even 1%.
DoK RR80+, Chosen RR80+, Choppa RR70+, WP RR65+

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Acidic
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Re: Balancing Kotbs VS Chossen!

Post#19 » Tue Mar 24, 2020 11:34 am

Jinxypie wrote:
Tue Mar 24, 2020 11:14 am
warhammer12345 wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 8:19 pm

My speech is now about KLotbs vs Chosen. I don't want to go into Slayer and Choppa. I'm interested in the two classes. Kotbs Chossen. Not more.
And thats the problem, cuz slayers just pop Rampage and poof... theres no parry or block anymore. Not 70% not 50% not even 1%.
Just now while in cities where there is limited space around objectives the slayer bypass Destro defense tactics, gear , rr points kind of just makes all Snb tanks role a lot less useful , I see this thread as cherry picking balance threads

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ahorts
Posts: 45

Re: Balancing Kotbs VS Chossen!

Post#20 » Tue Mar 24, 2020 12:12 pm

teiloh wrote:
Tue Mar 24, 2020 10:32 am
ahorts wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 9:09 pm

The game is not balanced 1v1, Chosen and KOTBS are not perfect mirror classes: Chosen has more parry and does more damage than KOTBS, KOTBS has better group utility, which more than makes up for what Chosen has.
Because of Focused Mending? The Chosen has plenty of group/WB utility.
Really? All the tactics a Chosen can spec for help only himself, Knight has tactics that are actually useful for his group.
https://builder.returnofreckoning.com/c ... 92,3108&t=
Do I have to spell it out for you? AOE snare, Crit debuff, healing increased for the group and a great M3. If you seriously care more about higher parry and loldps spirit dmg there's something wrong.
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