Invader/Warlord/Sov Token System

[zageen]

Maybe the lack of reward (except heal/ap potion) is the core of the problème.
Their is maybe an interest to get some Bind on loot TEMPORARY talisman/Stat Boost potion (that are less powerfull than their pair) for a certain cost (imagine trading useless invader for a +24 tali that expire in 2-3 days; or even better, royal for a +25 tali), or trading it for a 600 armor pot (best one is 660 uncommon , 825)

Make new talisman of exotique stats.

Melee power/healing power
Critical % (and bind it to a specifique gear piece , like shoulder)
Auto attack haste
armor penetration/reduction

I think the lack of reward for useless token and a profund change in current system can be the solution, if you wanna discuss about some idea i got @wargrimnir, pm me.

[BUMY]

Simple QoL fix:
Ad the invader medals along crests to the bags, so ppl over 70rr can choose which they want.

+1 Unlike other ' balance effecting recommendations ' I don't see how this would have any negative impact and would remove the whole ' i must only play city ' mentality.

[Omegus]

One of the big issues is this (I might be off-by-one with the RR ranks):

Classes that are RR40-RR49 can only get Invader tokens from the city.
Classes that are RR50-RR69 can get Invader tokens from fortresses and the city.
Classes that are RR70+ can only get Invader tokens from fortresses.

The higher RR characters have less chance to earn Invader tokens than the classes below them, and the only chance they do have is locked behind a population limit / contribution system. RR40-49 characters can farm Invader tokens "early" from the city (before cities you had to be RR50 to get them via forts or get one from defending a zone that lead to fort) while RR70 characters don't have the oppotunity to farm invader tokens "late".

I understand if you don't want a 5:1 conversion pattern if Royal to Invader down-conversion was a thing, but having a 1:1 conversion down (not up!!) seems fair. Alternatively, seeing as you can't equip Sov until you have the Invader ToK, rather than using RR to determine when a player switches from earning Invader crests to Royal crests in the city then use the ToK instead to determine when the switch happens. Still allow 1:1 down-conversion for existing tokens (Royals are useless with out Invader) and to allow for the Invader jewel to be optionally acquired as it's not tied into the ToK unlock.

It just seems odd that a RR70 character has a harder time acquiring gear too low for them compared to characters acquiring it at the "correct" time, especially when double XP/RR weekends are a thing that throw out any ratios between time played and gear earned.

[orillah]

One of the problems is -as a returning high rr player, i will prob have 1 if not 2 full sov sets before i can have invader.
By the time i got it, i will just equip it once for ToK unlock and put it in a stash, therefore "skipping" invader set completely. Invader is a good progression set, shame its a such spot.

[nat3s]

Fort currency is acquired from forts so people continue to have a reason to play, and get into, Forts. When fort currency is commonly available elsewhere, like from City siege, we get the example someone gave here already where they refuse to even play their character unless a city is available, because it allows them to not care about Forts and skip them.

I don't think that's accurate. I see 2 problems here:

1. I would LOVE to play Forts to earn Invader medallions so I could wear Sov, I really really WANT to play through Fort content... The problem here, which I was trying to champion above, is the fact that with Forts accepting 300 ish players and the server pop now hitting 3500 that's a ton of competition for spaces (city sieges have no such competition). If you login midway through the final zone you're unlikely to catch up on contrib and will miss out on a fort... but you will of course be able to queue for the city siege. City siege takes an hour, then zones reset to t2 so unless you play for like 6 hours, you're not going to see a second fort that day. I'm fairly hardcore, play up to 4 hours/day, i'm pretty much guaranteed a city siege each day at present with Order crushing it. I feel like I have a chance to work for Sov gear... I feel like I need luck for the opportunity to work for Invader gear...

2. As backwards as it sounds, the high server pop is destroying the game, people can earn their city gear, but have few opportunities to earn invader. This leads to the second problem.... The gear progression is fubar. At my current rate (4 hours/day) i will get full Sov in roughly a month, full Invader will take around 12-18 months. Invader gear will be skipped entirely once i get it as i'll comfortably have full Sov and Warlord by then (several times over).

Some possible solutions i can see:

1. Recognise Invader is way harder to get than Sov and thus make it the premium set with the best stats and bonuses. Require Sov unlock to equip Invader rather than the other way around.

2. If Invader is supposed to be a step behind Sov, then it needs to form part of the progression path, allow people to work for it! People should have a means to go from conq to vanq to invader to warlord to sov. At present invader and warlord are skipped. Allow those who don't get enough contrib in final zone prior to fort to earn invader medallions in rvr lakes whilst the fort is happening. Don't penalize people unlucky enough to login midway through the final zone.

3. Alternatively lift the fort pop cap, allow unlimited people in Forts like unlimited people can queue for city sieges.

4. Restrict city sieges to those who took part in the fort... This is incredibly punishing, but it would maintain the gear progression path. The problem atm is Sov can be earned by all, Invader can only be earned by a small proportion. This would restore gear progression and make sov as difficult to acquire as invader.

4. Increase sov costs, at present i see around 3 city sieges for every 1 fort i get into... So triple the cost of Sov to counter balance. Sov shouldn't be so undervalued and invader (for its ToK unlock only) be so overvalued.

Cheers

[M0rw47h]

stuff

We already had unlimited forts in the past, except huge lag spikes, defenders were nearly always winning and attackers couldn't even push past 1st doors to the flags.
You would get city once a week at best and happening at NA time, so EU players couldn't participate.


For me it's 10x easier to get into Forts than be able to play during city. Lately we got some cities in EU prime, but previously they were mostly happening either at nights or early at morning.

Edit: Not to mention full Sov cost 419 medalions. Average city has 2 stars (if they happen daily), if you win EVERY stage you get 6 medalions + bags, assuming you win everytime goldbag (5) and whitebag (1), you get 12 medalions per siege. So, if you get into city EVERY single day, and WIN it and get bags, as "casual" who can't get into forts, you still won't get Sov "within" month.

[zulnam]

There are flaws with this decission. No matter what you do, people can park. You wanna make forts relevant? People will park and ignore everything until a fort push. But then what about the other content? That's right, the content has enough players for it.

And so does the fort. If anything, people who don't need fort and park will give a chance to those who need fort but don't get a spot to do so. Literally two birds with one stone.

Also, many experienced players will still push fort. Because that's the path to a city. An organised warband running won't just 'stick to the side'. Most already have invader+ and they still go in.

Then this also addresses the case of classes/specs that want to jump over invader since it's not a good set for them.

[nat3s]

stuff

We already had unlimited forts in the past, except huge lag spikes, defenders were nearly always winning and attackers couldn't even push past 1st doors to the flags.
You would get city once a week at best and happening at NA time, so EU players couldn't participate.


For me it's 10x easier to get into Forts than be able to play during city. Lately we got some cities in EU prime, but previously they were mostly happening either at nights or early at morning.

I think Forts being dominated by defenders is actually exactly what is needed. That would be a great solution to lower the frequency of city sieges and make Sov harder to obtain. At present Sov is super easy to get which is a big problem, by the time you get invader - which will be months after finishing Sov/Warlord - you'll just skip it to equip your Sov.

Alternatively, as i suggest above, recognise how tough it is to get invader and therefore make it the premium endgame set, with Sov the set behind.

[M0rw47h]

stuff

We already had unlimited forts in the past, except huge lag spikes, defenders were nearly always winning and attackers couldn't even push past 1st doors to the flags.
You would get city once a week at best and happening at NA time, so EU players couldn't participate.


For me it's 10x easier to get into Forts than be able to play during city. Lately we got some cities in EU prime, but previously they were mostly happening either at nights or early at morning.

I think Forts being dominated by defenders is actually exactly what is needed. That would be a great solution to lower the frequency of city sieges and make Sov harder to obtain. At present Sov is super easy to get which is a big problem, by the time you get invader - which will be months after finishing Sov/Warlord - you'll just skip it to equip your Sov.

I will disgree again. If forts arre dominated by defenders, only defending side is getting royal medalions (you get one, if you win a fort). It will be better for side to defend than attack, and if you remove that royal medalion for defence, people will throw them to get into the city - thats first issue. Second thing, fact that you CAN get Sov before Invader isn't issue, you can also get Bloodlord before Redeye, but you won't be able to wear it. It's just matter of your priorities, I know people who just log for PvE lockouts and Cities.

I've myself more than one full Invader, working on another. It's really not big issue to get into fort, if you really want to. Not to mention, you also get invader for defending pre-fort zones. If you ain't sure you can get reservation in e.g. Chaos Wastes/Reikland push Black Crag/Kadrin Valley for double fort or defend the other low pop zone, if you're on the defending side.

Current system is supposed to reward you for playing for your realm and thats what you should do.
Yet, I still believe Warlord should be oRvR set NOT requiring Invader unlock as it's usualy offspec to invader.

Edit: And as I've suggested in other thread. I would simply add Warlord currency and give people 1 (!!!) medal for each oRvR zone they WIN, so they get more reasons to push zones for their realm instead of waiting for pre-fort zones (to get contribution when they need invader), or city when they just want WL/Sov.

[geraldtarrant]

Invader prices can be tuned down nowdays, since its not bis gear anymore, also increasing fort spots should help.