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About Reduce AOE Damage RvR Broken

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klighan
Posts: 5

About Reduce AOE Damage RvR Broken

Post#1 » Wed Jan 16, 2019 1:42 pm

Hello Everyone,

You can see on the game now the RvR combat duration Bus vs Bus is 4-10 sec and afther thath the combat is down.
Personaly i hate this system , all the AOE damage is to Hight . Is it necessary to decrease the damage for best RvR combat experience .

This change make :
- Better GamePlay
- Better RvR
- Possible removing playing in Bus vs Bus

The Administrator ' Yaliskah ' server say , if i reduce the AOE for exemple , all my community player leave the game.

Please talking about AOE

Have a nice day !

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peterthepan3
Posts: 6509

Re: About Reduce AOE Damage RvR Broken

Post#2 » Wed Jan 16, 2019 1:48 pm

klighan wrote: Wed Jan 16, 2019 1:42 pm
You can see on the game now the RvR combat duration Bus vs Bus is 4-10 sec and afther thath the combat is down.
Personaly i hate this system , all the AOE damage is to Hight . Is it necessary to decrease the damage for best RvR combat experience .

This change make :
- Better GamePlay
- Better RvR
- Possible removing playing in Bus vs Bus

Could you elaborate on these points, or are we to just believe you have found the ultimate solution blindly?
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klighan
Posts: 5

Re: About Reduce AOE Damage RvR Broken

Post#3 » Wed Jan 16, 2019 2:02 pm

For exemple

Reduce AOE damage , improve the time in combat.
The Class single target is Needed for killing the Healer and Long Range Dps
Actually the single target class is usless in RvR if you are not spec AOE

There is one exemple

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Wam
Posts: 803

Re: About Reduce AOE Damage RvR Broken

Post#4 » Wed Jan 16, 2019 4:00 pm

klighan wrote: Wed Jan 16, 2019 2:02 pm For exemple

Reduce AOE damage , improve the time in combat.
The Class single target is Needed for killing the Healer and Long Range Dps
Actually the single target class is usless in RvR if you are not spec AOE

There is one exemple
im sorry mate but you cannot be serious, you haven't thought out your concept fully and the realities of the game, and also the players habbits.

People blob up, people zerg for easy gains. less aoe = the guys with most number will win even more. (so then you will have realm health issues and that is counter productive)

The actual problem with the game at the moment is the aoe target cap of 9 and lack of spreading... this is pro zerging change that been in place forever but the zerging side take advantage of it now more than ever lately with extreme zerging and little desire for split/ good fights. So the side with the bigger mass wins by default, because the damage is spread (even if you try co-ordinate it) you cannot because 9 target cap being spread between 4 warbands stacked (96 players+) makes healing that sooooooooooo easy.

Where the underdog realm has less bodies to spread the damage, so they can just be auto attacked and grinded down without any care or counter threat - ala zerg and easy mode.

With the way the campaign mechanics are also with wait around on bo's and not spread out, get ram zerg keep.
Reducded AOE = RIP server, just pure zerg trash and all about which side has the most numbers / bodies which is boring... because guess what the side with the most bodies will be even more biased if there is even less of a counter than the current status quo.

If dev's really wanted to shake things up even more, they would improve target cap or remove it and see where the apple falls... because it always favours the side with the most numbers. Maybe people will swap zones to avoid resistance, I don't know but people are not discouraged from zerging as it is rewarded with this safety blanket in place.

1 wb vs 4 wb (stacked) you will get grinded down... 24 (8 dps) vs 96 ... and your 8 dps can only hit 9 targets each which is not always the same targets so its fluff damage because the spread favours the side with the bigger mass... where the 96 can pick and choose as the lesser number have less mass to spread out the aoe damage so its not fluff and real threat.

Or keep it as it whatever, but the system is biased/rigged towards zerging already. Just throw more bodies at the soultion seems to be the go to answer for everyone.

IF everyone was ST, time to kill is even less for the underdog realm dude... when people run in zone blobs of multiple warbands over hundred players... the side with the most number, gets way more single target attacks = more dps - pressure, heals, guards mitigation... rezzing... underdog won't have enough GCD / Assist to out kill that rez train.
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Aurandilaz
Posts: 1896

Re: About Reduce AOE Damage RvR Broken

Post#5 » Wed Jan 16, 2019 4:11 pm

If devs actually wanted to "split the zerg" and have anti-zerg mechanics, increased AoE cap would be one of the more sensible ways, as Wam above said, bigger side can now just hide in one big blob, first 9 targets (tanks) take dmg, if its 4 wbs like usual Order blob in one spot, only 9/96 take damage, everyone else can roleplay safely in the backline and pretend they are the true realm heroes.

Either increase underdogs AoE cap by 2 targets per each 20 AAO effective, or start implementing campaigns mechanics, like if your Keep lord has been killed, underdog has effective +2 AoE cap for next 6 hours. If 2nd Keep lord is killed, +2 AoE cap again for next 6 hours... meaning if Order for some reason goes to take 6 keeps in 6 hours, those 6 lord kills have given Destro +12 AoE cap. Eventually oldest "buff" vanishes and it drops to +10 then etc...
current system where one side just snowballs into a megablob and keeps taking empty keeps and defenders have little realistic chances of opposing the voltron, or are more or less actually rewarded more if they xrealm and join larger side to leech the keep lord kills which will feed their bagrolls over time... its absurd design, but somehow here we are. :)

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Reesh
Posts: 645

Re: About Reduce AOE Damage RvR Broken

Post#6 » Wed Jan 16, 2019 4:20 pm

Aurandilaz wrote: Wed Jan 16, 2019 4:11 pm If devs actually wanted to "split the zerg" and have anti-zerg mechanics, increased AoE cap would be one of the more sensible ways, as Wam above said, bigger side can now just hide in one big blob, first 9 targets (tanks) take dmg, if its 4 wbs like usual Order blob in one spot, only 9/96 take damage, everyone else can roleplay safely in the backline and pretend they are the true realm heroes.

Either increase underdogs AoE cap by 2 targets per each 20 AAO effective, or start implementing campaigns mechanics, like if your Keep lord has been killed, underdog has effective +2 AoE cap for next 6 hours. If 2nd Keep lord is killed, +2 AoE cap again for next 6 hours... meaning if Order for some reason goes to take 6 keeps in 6 hours, those 6 lord kills have given Destro +12 AoE cap. Eventually oldest "buff" vanishes and it drops to +10 then etc...
current system where one side just snowballs into a megablob and keeps taking empty keeps and defenders have little realistic chances of opposing the voltron, or are more or less actually rewarded more if they xrealm and join larger side to leech the keep lord kills which will feed their bagrolls over time... its absurd design, but somehow here we are. :)
Since the start I always told to remove the cap or double/triple it, because it won't benefit a blob as much, but for sure would benefit smaller, organized, well made 12-24 man to counter up the mindless zerging.
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Dammy095
Posts: 371

Re: About Reduce AOE Damage RvR Broken

Post#7 » Wed Jan 16, 2019 4:30 pm

what do you guys think of morales tho, going back for slower gain will benefit zerg or underdog more ? or neither ?

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altharion1
Banned
Posts: 321

Re: About Reduce AOE Damage RvR Broken

Post#8 » Wed Jan 16, 2019 4:33 pm

I'm sure letting premade optimized WB's win 24 v 120 encounters would be fantastic for the game.
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Kabuterimonga
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Posts: 184

Re: About Reduce AOE Damage RvR Broken

Post#9 » Wed Jan 16, 2019 6:36 pm

Here i give you a solution to this "problem"...

Make AoE Heals not have a group limit, make it for everyone who is standing inside the range of the aoe heals. There you will have longer fights.

edit: AoE Heals could have a reduction for each target it heals, for example after 6 players beeing hit by your heals it starts to diminish to a limit of let say 14. This would require a total rework of the skill let say my aoe heal does 9000 to 6 players, 1500 to each one, if it heals 14 players it should heal 650 to each one, and so on.
Last edited by Kabuterimonga on Wed Jan 16, 2019 6:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Arbich
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Re: About Reduce AOE Damage RvR Broken

Post#10 » Wed Jan 16, 2019 6:42 pm

Wam wrote: Wed Jan 16, 2019 4:00 pm
klighan wrote: Wed Jan 16, 2019 2:02 pm For exemple

Reduce AOE damage , improve the time in combat.
The Class single target is Needed for killing the Healer and Long Range Dps
Actually the single target class is usless in RvR if you are not spec AOE

There is one exemple
im sorry mate but you cannot be serious, you haven't thought out your concept fully and the realities of the game, and also the players habbits.

People blob up, people zerg for easy gains. less aoe = the guys with most number will win even more. (so then you will have realm health issues and that is counter productive)

The actual problem with the game at the moment is the aoe target cap of 9 and lack of spreading... this is pro zerging change that been in place forever but the zerging side take advantage of it now more than ever lately with extreme zerging and little desire for split/ good fights. So the side with the bigger mass wins by default, because the damage is spread (even if you try co-ordinate it) you cannot because 9 target cap being spread between 4 warbands stacked (96 players+) makes healing that sooooooooooo easy.

Where the underdog realm has less bodies to spread the damage, so they can just be auto attacked and grinded down without any care or counter threat - ala zerg and easy mode.

With the way the campaign mechanics are also with wait around on bo's and not spread out, get ram zerg keep.
Reducded AOE = RIP server, just pure zerg trash and all about which side has the most numbers / bodies which is boring... because guess what the side with the most bodies will be even more biased if there is even less of a counter than the current status quo.

If dev's really wanted to shake things up even more, they would improve target cap or remove it and see where the apple falls... because it always favours the side with the most numbers. Maybe people will swap zones to avoid resistance, I don't know but people are not discouraged from zerging as it is rewarded with this safety blanket in place.

1 wb vs 4 wb (stacked) you will get grinded down... 24 (8 dps) vs 96 ... and your 8 dps can only hit 9 targets each which is not always the same targets so its fluff damage because the spread favours the side with the bigger mass... where the 96 can pick and choose as the lesser number have less mass to spread out the aoe damage so its not fluff and real threat.

Or keep it as it whatever, but the system is biased/rigged towards zerging already. Just throw more bodies at the soultion seems to be the go to answer for everyone.

IF everyone was ST, time to kill is even less for the underdog realm dude... when people run in zone blobs of multiple warbands over hundred players... the side with the most number, gets way more single target attacks = more dps - pressure, heals, guards mitigation... rezzing... underdog won't have enough GCD / Assist to out kill that rez train.
Why not a combination of both? Increase the cap and reduce the damage (and rework morale abilities/apply a immunity to morale damage). So AoE for severly weaken the enemy and and then pick up single targets individually to kill them? This would also remove the lamentations of classes that lack strong AoE abilities.

Because 1wb should usually lose against 4 wb or at least not win with as little efford as to click one button at the same time...
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