[Set Preview] Bloodlord

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Hargrim
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Re: [Set Preview] Bloodlord

Post#171 » Tue Jul 09, 2019 6:40 am

Try to think of this as not a single player egocentric experience, but more in line of "this content is designed for 6 people, what would happen in case I want it, but nobody will run it with me?".

I know it might be really, really hard.

And at the end you will come to realization, that this is so there are more or less always people running the dungeons, because they need them to progress to the next PvE gear tier. As easy as that. Also, the early PvE gear is not worthless - it have a worth in allowing you to equip the better set. Gunbad is 12 hours to finish if you don't get any drop on bosses, Sentinel is 8 hours in the same case.

And yes, you will need Bloodlord to equip Dark Promise (Lost Vale set) and Dark Promise to equip Tyrant (ToVL set). As for City Siege Dungeons it's not decided yet.
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Azerreth
Posts: 58

Re: [Set Preview] Bloodlord

Post#172 » Tue Jul 09, 2019 7:06 am

Hargrim wrote:
Tue Jul 09, 2019 6:40 am
Try to think of this as not a single player egocentric experience, but more in line of "this content is designed for 6 people, what would happen in case I want it, but nobody will run it with me?".

I know it might be really, really hard.

And at the end you will come to realization, that this is so there are more or less always people running the dungeons, because they need them to progress to the next PvE gear tier. As easy as that. Also, the early PvE gear is not worthless - it have a worth in allowing you to equip the better set. Gunbad is 12 hours to finish if you don't get any drop on bosses, Sentinel is 8 hours in the same case.

And yes, you will need Bloodlord to equip Dark Promise (Lost Vale set) and Dark Promise to equip Tyrant (ToVL set). As for City Siege Dungeons it's not decided yet.
It has nothing to do with the Egocentric nature that you so clearly believe I have. It's that this games PvE never even in live shined and im not alone in not wanting to have to do ALL of it to get the one set I want. (You all have done a marvelous job at making sure disparities in the gearing is not as vast. And I truly mean that, Its good that specific sets seem to be better tailored to a specific build, or playstyle.)

Insults aimed to make me seem like a child aside, it seems you have more of a focus on PvE as you have basically outlined that going forward there will be sets to come from other sources of PvE Which im not against. What I am against is for those sets to be linked into people who like the RvR or PvP over the PvE to be expected to just "Go spend Eight hours doing this thing", I mean I don't want the dungeons to be simplistic or easy no. Make em challenging. But this is not that, this is basically time-gating which is appalling in most cases when it comes down to games that are not a private server.

The way my mind makes this seem is like this, and Ill make sure to put it bluntly because I feel there is no need to skirt around the issue. You've made RvR less worthwhile than really just leveling, getting ruin armor and then moving into the dungeons to get gear. Why bother going to get annihilator, conq or even vanq when the road to gearing is so much less difficult or time consuming you can level at your own pace. Why bother the RR will catch up eventually anyhow, and the gear itself will provide plenty of benefits. (We also saw this when Annihilator was the be all and end all, ruin was sought heavily because it was equal too if not greater than in some circumstances.)

With the changes made to how Bo's work and how leveling through RvR seems painfully slow compared to how it used to be, It seems you guys are really pushing PvE into the lime-light when live allowed either or to work both ways. A PvE player could walk out with their dungeon gear and compete with geared players similar to their level; RvR players and SC players could take their gear into the dungeons to get a set they want and not need to worry if they hadn't done the others. Now I understand this is your playground, your way. And im sure Ill get some witty degrading retort aimed to make it seem like Im not familiar your understand you, which is fine.

Lets be clear, I care not about the "Egocentric" views of a person or their ideals that what I and so many others want is a "Single player" Driven expierence. Because Im going to be real with you here people would do the content, Id run my friends through the content. I have friends who LOATH pvp and I could bring them to the game and go through the content, their is an audience out there who hates pvp and would come for that content. (I mean look at modern MMO-Rpgs? Like their pvp even matters at all.) But lets say they are geared through the dungeons, and maybe we are at the same tier or even Im the tier right below them. We do the dungeon, I Get the gear alongside them but now I can't wear it because I don't have the ward required because my RVR armor is trash-can useless in that department. So now I gotta go do Eight hours over here, which depending on your scheduel may or may not be doable in a decent time-frame. Which is why alot of people just won't do it at all, I mean I Haven't seen bloodlord armor at all. I've seen groups to go do the dungeons sure but not as many as people would say, there are a ton more doing RvR. (It almost feels like a punishment if your prioritize RvR the games core foundation, over PvE.)

You can't force people to do the content, all this is doing is making it Niche content with a very Niche audience like the Gw2 raids or hell WoW's PvP. People won't go do it despite the best attempts to get people too; Despite what some might say alot of us come here for the RvR and PvP because this game feels like No other game out there. I do love this game, don't mistake my frustration for a lack of love or appreciation. Locking the armor behind warding doesn't make me want to go do the dungeons anymore, it just makes me go "Bleh PvE stuff." Which sucks because I bet the gear looks pretty cool since its an entirely new appearance~

~Have a good one, happy hunting.

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Hargrim
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Posts: 2426

Re: [Set Preview] Bloodlord

Post#173 » Tue Jul 09, 2019 7:32 am

Azerreth wrote:
Tue Jul 09, 2019 7:06 am
It has nothing to do with the Egocentric nature that you so clearly believe I have. It's that this games PvE never even in live shined and im not alone in not wanting to have to do ALL of it to get the one set I want. (You all have done a marvelous job at making sure disparities in the gearing is not as vast. And I truly mean that, Its good that specific sets seem to be better tailored to a specific build, or playstyle.)

Well, all I see in what you post is "I don't want to do that" and after that "no, I'm not egocentric". Sounds kind of mutually exclusive.

Insults aimed to make me seem like a child aside

Another one. What insults?

it seems you have more of a focus on PvE as you have basically outlined that going forward there will be sets to come from other sources of PvE Which im not against. What I am against is for those sets to be linked into people who like the RvR or PvP over the PvE to be expected to just "Go spend Eight hours doing this thing", I mean I don't want the dungeons to be simplistic or easy no. Make em challenging. But this is not that, this is basically time-gating which is appalling in most cases when it comes down to games that are not a private server.

But it is - you have a content that is challenging (or is it not?) and you have a worst case scenario (do it for 8 hours) to finish this content. It's not some kind of appalling time-gating, it's a sensible removal of excessive RNG, which is indeed truly appalling.

The way my mind makes this seem is like this, and Ill make sure to put it bluntly because I feel there is no need to skirt around the issue. You've made RvR less worthwhile than really just leveling, getting ruin armor and then moving into the dungeons to get gear. Why bother going to get annihilator, conq or even vanq when the road to gearing is so much less difficult or time consuming you can level at your own pace. Why bother the RR will catch up eventually anyhow, and the gear itself will provide plenty of benefits. (We also saw this when Annihilator was the be all and end all, ruin was sought heavily because it was equal too if not greater than in some circumstances.)

With the changes made to how Bo's work and how leveling through RvR seems painfully slow compared to how it used to be, It seems you guys are really pushing PvE into the lime-light when live allowed either or to work both ways. A PvE player could walk out with their dungeon gear and compete with geared players similar to their level; RvR players and SC players could take their gear into the dungeons to get a set they want and not need to worry if they hadn't done the others. Now I understand this is your playground, your way. And im sure Ill get some witty degrading retort aimed to make it seem like Im not familiar your understand you, which is fine.

But nobody force you to do anything - if you want to do just PvP or SCs, just do them. Having a content that is relatively easy to obtain from PvE is not pushing PvE into lime-light, it's taking it from deep, dark hole it was pushed by live. Another sensible way to gear your character instead of having just 2 ways to get gear you now have 3 ways. And... You can still take your PvP gear to Gunbad and run it with a smile on your face. No need to finish it in Ruin.

Lets be clear, I care not about the "Egocentric" views of a person or their ideals that what I and so many others want is a "Single player" Driven expierence. Because Im going to be real with you here people would do the content, Id run my friends through the content. I have friends who LOATH pvp and I could bring them to the game and go through the content, their is an audience out there who hates pvp and would come for that content. (I mean look at modern MMO-Rpgs? Like their pvp even matters at all.) But lets say they are geared through the dungeons, and maybe we are at the same tier or even Im the tier right below them. We do the dungeon, I Get the gear alongside them but now I can't wear it because I don't have the ward required because my RVR armor is trash-can useless in that department. So now I gotta go do Eight hours over here, which depending on your scheduel may or may not be doable in a decent time-frame. Which is why alot of people just won't do it at all, I mean I Haven't seen bloodlord armor at all. I've seen groups to go do the dungeons sure but not as many as people would say, there are a ton more doing RvR. (It almost feels like a punishment if your prioritize RvR the games core foundation, over PvE.)

If you don't like it don't do it. If you helped friends to get a set they need but you don't, but you already have it... Ask them to run lower dungeons with you, so you can equip this? It's really that easy.

You can't force people to do the content, all this is doing is making it Niche content with a very Niche audience like the Gw2 raids or hell WoW's PvP. People won't go do it despite the best attempts to get people too; Despite what some might say alot of us come here for the RvR and PvP because this game feels like No other game out there. I do love this game, don't mistake my frustration for a lack of love or appreciation. Locking the armor behind warding doesn't make me want to go do the dungeons anymore, it just makes me go "Bleh PvE stuff." Which sucks because I bet the gear looks pretty cool since its an entirely new appearance~

Nobody is holding a gun to your head, nobody is forcing you to do anything. Don't like it - skip it, get current PvP set and wait for the BIS PvP only Sov set that is at the end.

Cheers.
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Ysaran
Posts: 493

Re: [Set Preview] Bloodlord

Post#174 » Tue Jul 09, 2019 7:45 am

Azerreth wrote:
Tue Jul 09, 2019 7:06 am
Hargrim wrote:
Tue Jul 09, 2019 6:40 am
Try to think of this as not a single player egocentric experience, but more in line of "this content is designed for 6 people, what would happen in case I want it, but nobody will run it with me?".

I know it might be really, really hard.

And at the end you will come to realization, that this is so there are more or less always people running the dungeons, because they need them to progress to the next PvE gear tier. As easy as that. Also, the early PvE gear is not worthless - it have a worth in allowing you to equip the better set. Gunbad is 12 hours to finish if you don't get any drop on bosses, Sentinel is 8 hours in the same case.

And yes, you will need Bloodlord to equip Dark Promise (Lost Vale set) and Dark Promise to equip Tyrant (ToVL set). As for City Siege Dungeons it's not decided yet.
It has nothing to do with the Egocentric nature that you so clearly believe I have. It's that this games PvE never even in live shined and im not alone in not wanting to have to do ALL of it to get the one set I want. (You all have done a marvelous job at making sure disparities in the gearing is not as vast. And I truly mean that, Its good that specific sets seem to be better tailored to a specific build, or playstyle.)

Insults aimed to make me seem like a child aside, it seems you have more of a focus on PvE as you have basically outlined that going forward there will be sets to come from other sources of PvE Which im not against. What I am against is for those sets to be linked into people who like the RvR or PvP over the PvE to be expected to just "Go spend Eight hours doing this thing", I mean I don't want the dungeons to be simplistic or easy no. Make em challenging. But this is not that, this is basically time-gating which is appalling in most cases when it comes down to games that are not a private server.

The way my mind makes this seem is like this, and Ill make sure to put it bluntly because I feel there is no need to skirt around the issue. You've made RvR less worthwhile than really just leveling, getting ruin armor and then moving into the dungeons to get gear. Why bother going to get annihilator, conq or even vanq when the road to gearing is so much less difficult or time consuming you can level at your own pace. Why bother the RR will catch up eventually anyhow, and the gear itself will provide plenty of benefits. (We also saw this when Annihilator was the be all and end all, ruin was sought heavily because it was equal too if not greater than in some circumstances.)

With the changes made to how Bo's work and how leveling through RvR seems painfully slow compared to how it used to be, It seems you guys are really pushing PvE into the lime-light when live allowed either or to work both ways. A PvE player could walk out with their dungeon gear and compete with geared players similar to their level; RvR players and SC players could take their gear into the dungeons to get a set they want and not need to worry if they hadn't done the others. Now I understand this is your playground, your way. And im sure Ill get some witty degrading retort aimed to make it seem like Im not familiar your understand you, which is fine.

Lets be clear, I care not about the "Egocentric" views of a person or their ideals that what I and so many others want is a "Single player" Driven expierence. Because Im going to be real with you here people would do the content, Id run my friends through the content. I have friends who LOATH pvp and I could bring them to the game and go through the content, their is an audience out there who hates pvp and would come for that content. (I mean look at modern MMO-Rpgs? Like their pvp even matters at all.) But lets say they are geared through the dungeons, and maybe we are at the same tier or even Im the tier right below them. We do the dungeon, I Get the gear alongside them but now I can't wear it because I don't have the ward required because my RVR armor is trash-can useless in that department. So now I gotta go do Eight hours over here, which depending on your scheduel may or may not be doable in a decent time-frame. Which is why alot of people just won't do it at all, I mean I Haven't seen bloodlord armor at all. I've seen groups to go do the dungeons sure but not as many as people would say, there are a ton more doing RvR. (It almost feels like a punishment if your prioritize RvR the games core foundation, over PvE.)

You can't force people to do the content, all this is doing is making it Niche content with a very Niche audience like the Gw2 raids or hell WoW's PvP. People won't go do it despite the best attempts to get people too; Despite what some might say alot of us come here for the RvR and PvP because this game feels like No other game out there. I do love this game, don't mistake my frustration for a lack of love or appreciation. Locking the armor behind warding doesn't make me want to go do the dungeons anymore, it just makes me go "Bleh PvE stuff." Which sucks because I bet the gear looks pretty cool since its an entirely new appearance~

~Have a good one, happy hunting.
If you really think that a r40/rr0 full bloodlord character can compete with a r40/rr40 annhi character you were not playing ror, lol. for the rest, nothing to add to what Hargrim said.

P.S you can even do gunbad without 0% chances to be critted, so no you cant skip PvP and go full PvE

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