Morals redesign idea

[catholicism198]

Take off the AoE cap on damaging morales or don't.

Restore the 15 point morale's to their spec specific locations and reduce them back to 1 minute cooldown.

What your proposing Aza is what you were doing prior which is messing with stuff that shouldn't be messed with to fit your vision or relive what you went through previously with RoR. Your positioning yourself to make the same mistake.

This stuff isn't broke and is part of the overall class balance. Class balance is not exempt from what is happening with morale's.

He's not doing anything to fit his vision- morale bombing has been something that a lot of people have been complaining about and he has even created a thread for people to voice their opinion on the matter and possible solutions.

Furthermore, he has also already stated that he's not a fan of moving m4 to core and adding experimental 15 point abilities in their place- That was a change Torque decided on, which I believe you already know seeing as how you had a contentious argument with him about moving the Squig's m4 to core.

I'm not sure how I feel about the m4/15 point ability, on one hand you get a new ability, and on the other- if you use that m4 you gimp yourself for five minutes.

[roadkillrobin]

An immunity timer or bomb limit can be introduced by ensuring that all damaging morales are DoTs and they are in the same group, of which only X may be active on a target at one time. This may also spread out the burst a little.

The problem with this is that it plays into the gear issue aswell. With a dot portion you essentially just boost the dps output of the side that allready have better dps output from gear and rr (and certainly better cordination and dps rotations aswell) allready, aswell as giving the side that have better healing output (which they get from gear and rr) a better chance.

What about increasing the hitcaps in RVR Lakes with like 100% and have it like normal in Scenarios? I know it would cause issues with small scale encounters in the lakes but it might also deal with the Morale dmg issues. CC's would be in needing to be tweaked to last longer aswell.

[Azarael]

Indeed. As previously stated, I would love nothing more than if someone else on the team were able to handle large scale design. I don't have a horse in this race.

[footpatrol2]

Morale bombing is a natural part of the game.

This game at one time supported heavy defensive morale cycle's and also supported some very high mitigation value's via gear.

There had to be a way in the game's design to tear apart those aspects which there were.

The game in it's design has ways to pierce through those defensive morale cycle's AND the high mitigation value's of upper echelon gear.

At the small and large scale your group composition should always have taken into account how to deal with morale bombs and how to deal with strong buffing/debuffing group comps that take advantage of these powerful morale's. If your not taking into account these different group type compositions then that is the fault of YOUR group composition and not of the game.

Roughly 1/4th to 1/5th of organized play revolves around the use of timing/coordinating morale's. Which btw is why I harped on the morale gain rates for so long.

[Genisaurus]

The problem with this is that it plays into the gear issue aswell. With a dot portion you essentially just boost the dps output of the side that allready have better dps output from gear and rr (and certainly better cordination and dps rotations aswell) allready, aswell as giving the side that have better healing output (which they get from gear and rr) a better chance.

How does converting DD morales to DoT effects boost the DPS output of one side more than the DD morales already do? The healing argument is a good point though, having warning that you have a Morale DoT effect on you means it can be healed through, as opposed to no-warning direct damage.

Could these concerns be addressed by giving each morale a unique cooldown timer, with high damage bombing morales being on a longer cooldown? Without using specific numbers you could have something like

Shortest CD -> Longest CD:
Single target damage/defense -> Group Buff/Debuff -> Group Defense -> AoE Damage

With adjustments for specific cases. Lowest CDs start at the classic 60s.

Alternatively, what about this idea?

1. lower the base morale gain rate, and scale it up by the number of people in your group.
2. Then hijack the unused main-assist functionality to designate someone as the parties' morale user, and they are the only ones who generate morale, but at the increased rate.
3. Buff underperforming morales (or nerf overperforming ones) to make their selection an actual strategic decision for a group.

Just throwing **** at the wall to see what sticks.

[roadkillrobin]

The problem with this is that it plays into the gear issue aswell. With a dot portion you essentially just boost the dps output of the side that allready have better dps output from gear and rr (and certainly better cordination and dps rotations aswell) allready, aswell as giving the side that have better healing output (which they get from gear and rr) a better chance.

How does converting DD morales to DoT effects boost the DPS output of one side more than the DD morales already do? The healing argument is a good point though, having warning that you have a Morale DoT effect on you means it can be healed through, as opposed to no-warning direct damage.

Could these concerns be addressed by giving each morale a unique cooldown timer, with high damage bombing morales being on a longer cooldown? Without using specific numbers you could have something like

Shortest CD -> Longest CD:
Single target damage/defense -> Group Buff/Debuff -> Group Defense -> AoE Damage

With adjustments for specific cases. Lowest CDs start at the classic 60s.

Alternatively, what about this idea?

1. lower the base morale gain rate, and scale it up by the number of people in your group.
2. Then hijack the unused main-assist functionality to designate someone as the parties' morale user, and they are the only ones who generate morale, but at the increased rate.
3. Buff underperforming morales (or nerf overperforming ones) to make their selection an actual strategic decision for a group.

Just throwing **** at the wall to see what sticks.

Coz the DoT effect would sit ontop of normal damage being dealt, so the outcome would still be that the side with better stuff would deal more damage. But I just now relized that here's were CC's like AoE staggers, AOE KB and AoE roots would actually be pretty usefull. The problem with it is the immunity, were a solo PuG can come a ruin the entire outcome. Maybe a tweak to the AoE CC immunites and AoE Morale DoT''s might actually be a good sollution.

I don't think different CD would solve anything. There's just to long resets between engagements. And then it also turns into a game of whoever wasted their CD in a previus fight vs people who have theirs off CD if timers are to long.

Morale rates are to inbeded into the entire class designs to be messed with imo. You would need to redesign almoast every class from scratch to work this out. It's part of the core combat system.

[catholicism198]

There is no way to counter morale bombs except with more morale bombs, and even then it's just a race to see who can hit m2/m3/m4 the fastest.

If you really want a counter to morale bombs then you would have to do something like swap Divine Protection with Focused Mind, make Divine Protection absorb morale damage, extent its duration, and then remove the visual effect from the enemy faction sight so they would not know that you have a counter set up.

Torque has mentioned reviewing each morale and adjusting its CD based on its potency, but that just needlessly complicates things.

[footpatrol2]

There are ways to counter morale bombs, Death drains all morale's, There are morale's that drain in AoE, abilities that drain morale's and tactic's that drain morale's. Even some gear had morale drain components on it.

Also, at one time AoR supported via the old renown rank system, that a single player's death drained a x amount of morale via AoE. You had to spend renown points thou to buy the rvr tactic.

[Kabuterimonga]

Spoiler:

All this talk about morale issue...do you know what the real problem is...Bright Wizzards, just nerf them to oblivion that's what they deserve and everything will be balanced

If you don't have anything productive to say, don't say it. - Dan

[Acidic]

....
A: The numbers will always be the strongest.
B: Finding a meaningful way of progression past lvl 40.
....

Point a)
Well for my part Numbers should win unless you are more skillful(morals != skill),
Numbers win with or without morals as both sides have moral, so same same but less cheeze


Point B)

Well not sure that has anything to do with morals , that gear, rr ..
and something not invented yet probably.